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Would you replace your CCS port with the Tesla port?


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F150ROD

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Tesla has made patents available in the past, oh but only after they have improved on the released tech and aren't using it anymore.

Might this mean Tesla is dumping info in advance of converting to CCS?

I'll pass on putting Tesla in charge of consensus-based non-proprietary standards development thank you.
This might be it. If they plan on opening up the SC network to non Teslas they will need to have CCS available at SC stations. I’m assuming they don’t want to take on the cost of converting so they are trying to see if everyone else will convert instead
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metroshot

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This might be it. If they plan on opening up the SC network to non Teslas they will need to have CCS available at SC stations. I’m assuming they don’t want to take on the cost of converting so they are trying to see if everyone else will convert instead
All I want out of Tesla SC access for my Lightning would be to use their plug and my CCS adapter with a MUCH LONGER cord.

Current Tesla charge cord is way too short to reach my Lightning port!
 

Tomwilli2025

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Interesting conversation from Kyle and Dave.


 

BennyTheBeaver

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Warning, potentially unpopular opinion here...

Tesla is going to come crashing back down to earth.

Tesla has enjoyed 13 years of virtually no competition. The big automakers haven't cared as the demand for EV was small in 2009-2018. Now that they care they have to design and ramp up. It's easy to sell unlimited amounts of vehicles when virtually no one is competing against you. Now that other automakers are starting to ramp up their EV lines and people have a choice, Tesla will quickly lose their artificially inflated market share.

The things Tesla fanboys love about Tesla's will begin to become more common across the industry. All the negatives that exist with Tesla (build quality, lack of repair facilities, recalls, volatile CEO) will still be there.

Soon there will be a new negative Tesla fanboys will have to deal with...congested charging infrastructure. We all know the gripes with the current available CCS network (reliability, congestion). We also know that new charging infrastructure will be outpaced by demand. Once Tesla opens up their network to everyone, all us CCS folks will gladly start charging at Tesla stations.
 

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MichaelCA

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Warning, potentially unpopular opinion here...

Tesla is going to come crashing back down to earth.

Tesla has enjoyed 13 years of virtually no competition. The big automakers haven't cared as the demand for EV was small in 2009-2018. Now that they care they have to design and ramp up. It's easy to sell unlimited amounts of vehicles when virtually no one is competing against you. Now that other automakers are starting to ramp up their EV lines and people have a choice, Tesla will quickly lose their artificially inflated market share.

The things Tesla fanboys love about Tesla's will begin to become more common across the industry. All the negatives that exist with Tesla (build quality, lack of repair facilities, recalls, volatile CEO) will still be there.

Soon there will be a new negative Tesla fanboys will have to deal with...congested charging infrastructure. We all know the gripes with the current available CCS network (reliability, congestion). We also know that new charging infrastructure will be outpaced by demand. Once Tesla opens up their network to everyone, all us CCS folks will gladly start charging at Tesla stations.
Teslas recent build quality was fine. My family and friends have a dozen 3s/Ys (Camry of California) and they all seem to be holding up. Build quality atleast in our vehicles are fairly good but talking about build quality, Ive seen alot worse in other manufacturers, ESPECIALLY Ford. Dont get me started the current mustangs panel gaps can be pretty atrocious. One thing alot of people shit talk is the autopilot, in my experience it works amazing. Unlike autopilot, Bluecruise had been pretty poor for me, its lane centering is bad, almost leaving the lane before I pull it back in, and also it seems to ignore cars merging in front of me until the last moment and slams the brakes. Teslas tech pack is also more advanced, seatbelt tightening when collision is imminent, green light alert even on non FSD models, walk away lock, prewarming battery when going to a supercharger, heat pump, predictable update schedule, etc. I think Tesla will be fine in the coming years, IIRC their profit is the same as Toyota but sells like a fraction amount of cars vs Toyota. They also have a BEV from the ground up chassis allowing for better battery packaging, and a huge frunk, a limitation present on many recent BEVs since they use ICE off the shell parts/chassis which dont account for a frunk.

I'm unsure about if Tesla will open up their supercharging network, I love being able to find a supercharger and knowing its 99% going to work and charge fast. Electrify America is what I use for my Lightning and finding WORKING stations that aren't packed, slow charging, or far away is a chore. Until Tesla decides to to open it up, the supercharger network is still a huge selling point.


The lack of repair facilities can be a problem. But, the majority of EV purchases are densly located in California, New England area, Florida, Texas. Huge population centers where repair facilities are more common. They also have vans that come to your home for smaller repair jobs.
 
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BennyTheBeaver

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Teslas recent build quality was fine. My family and friends have a dozen 3s/Ys (Camry of California) and they all seem to be holding up. Build quality atleast in our vehicles are fairly good but talking about build quality, Ive seen alot worse in other manufacturers, ESPECIALLY Ford. Dont get me started the current mustangs panel gaps can be pretty atrocious. One thing alot of people shit talk is the autopilot, in my experience it works amazing. Unlike autopilot, Bluecruise had been pretty poor for me, its lane centering is bad, almost leaving the lane before I pull it back in, and also it seems to ignore cars merging in front of me until the last moment and slams the brakes. Teslas tech pack is also more advanced, seatbelt tightening when collision is imminent, green light alert even on non FSD models, walk away lock, prewarming battery when going to a supercharger, heat pump, predictable update schedule, etc. I think Tesla will be fine in the coming years, IIRC their profit is the same as Toyota but sells like a fraction amount of cars vs Toyota. They also have a BEV from the ground up chassis allowing for better battery packaging, and a huge frunk, a limitation present on many recent BEVs since they use ICE off the shell parts/chassis which dont account for a frunk.

I'm unsure about if Tesla will open up their supercharging network, I love being able to find a supercharger and knowing its 99% going to work and charge fast. Electrify America is what I use for my Lightning and finding WORKING stations that aren't packed, slow charging, or far away is a chore. Until Tesla decides to to open it up, the supercharger network is still a huge selling point.


The lack of repair facilities can be a problem. But, the majority of EV purchases are densly located in California, New England area, Florida, Texas. Huge population centers where repair facilities are more common. They also have vans that come to your home for smaller repair jobs.
Very fair points.

I've never actually owned a Tesla, driven yes. You would know better than I. If/When Tesla opens up their charging network, everything changes.
 

Blainestang

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Warning, potentially unpopular opinion here...

Tesla is going to come crashing back down to earth.

Tesla has enjoyed 13 years of virtually no competition. The big automakers haven't cared as the demand for EV was small in 2009-2018. Now that they care they have to design and ramp up. It's easy to sell unlimited amounts of vehicles when virtually no one is competing against you. Now that other automakers are starting to ramp up their EV lines and people have a choice, Tesla will quickly lose their artificially inflated market share.

The things Tesla fanboys love about Tesla's will begin to become more common across the industry. All the negatives that exist with Tesla (build quality, lack of repair facilities, recalls, volatile CEO) will still be there.

Soon there will be a new negative Tesla fanboys will have to deal with...congested charging infrastructure. We all know the gripes with the current available CCS network (reliability, congestion). We also know that new charging infrastructure will be outpaced by demand. Once Tesla opens up their network to everyone, all us CCS folks will gladly start charging at Tesla stations.
Telsa's continued growth rate is predicated on the EV market share of the total vehicle market growing more quickly than they lose EV-specific market share.

It's absolutely inevitable that they lose EV market share. They can't keep 65% of the EV market forever.

But if the EV market goes from 5% to 20% (Quadruples) and Tesla's EV Market Share drops to 40% in that time, they still grew very quickly.

As far as build quality, much of that problem seems to be related to two things: One, they have no immediate reason to fix it. They still can't make cars fast enough. It's like how Ford will eventually need to sell more Pro/XLT versions of the Lightning to grow, but they just don't have to yet. Two, the build quality in China seems way better, so it's reasonable to conclude part of the problem is the Fremont (California) factory, which was originally a GM/Toyota factory and probably needs to be improved (machinery, training?) but hasn't had a chance to since it's been running all-out most of its existence.

As far as infrastructure, Tesla chargers are probably already more congested than CCS. There are certainly a far, far higher percentage of Tesla cars that are road-tripping per plug than CCS. I think the number of plugs are relatively similar, but Teslas probably account for 75% of all road-trip capable EVs.

Obviously, a lot of this is speculation both ways, but I think Tesla can continue their success, but still lose EV market share. EVs are going to quickly take over overall market share as more and more people experience good EVs like the Lightning, Tesla, Taycan, Mach E, Ioniq5, etc.
 

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meow

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Musk says customers don't want vehicle to home.
I don't know anyone who wouldn't want this functionality, but then again I must not be socializing in the same echo chamber-y circles as he is.

This might be it. If they plan on opening up the SC network to non Teslas they will need to have CCS available at SC stations. I’m assuming they don’t want to take on the cost of converting so they are trying to see if everyone else will convert instead
Teslas in Europe have been produced with the (Euro-spec) CCS connector for years. Considering their vertical integration efforts, the cost of conversion is probably limited to parts. I suspect the biggest reason they wouldn't want to switch is PR. This is a consumer win/lose scenario that would absolutely be covered in the news as a manufacturer win/lose.

Warning, potentially unpopular opinion here...

Tesla is going to come crashing back down to earth.

[snipped]

Soon there will be a new negative Tesla fanboys will have to deal with...congested charging infrastructure. We all know the gripes with the current available CCS network (reliability, congestion). We also know that new charging infrastructure will be outpaced by demand. Once Tesla opens up their network to everyone, all us CCS folks will gladly start charging at Tesla stations.
I don't disagree with you. I don't think they're going to go away, mostly because of the charging infrastructure they've built, that's their core product offering. It would be utter nonsense to not open it to other vehicles at this point, the only concern on my part is the likelihood of price gouging and how that could push all DCFC up in cost. I'm almost expecting that they open up at $0.80/kWh for non-Tesla vehicles and, given their ubiquity, become quite popular in a bind, or for those without the ability to charge at home. EA and others start bumping their prices up and suddenly we're paying $50 for a 20-80% DCFC charge of 60kWh.

While us early adopters can afford it, this would hurt EV adoption rates.
 
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GDN

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Being a Tesla owner for 4 years, the first time I stopped at an EA station (which the first 2 of 3 pedestals didn't work) I thought that plug and cable truly had to be a joke of some kind.

So it may not be Tesla, but things will change. We will not transition to a huge EV owning society and in 20 years 80% of the cars be using chargers with that ugly heavy unwieldy plug.

I'm not afraid to give Ford props, the build and quiet ride of my Lightning is better than the 2 2018 Model 3's we've owned, but on the other hand the software and drive train control can't hold a candle to Tesla. I also rode in an Austin built '22 Model Y this week and Tesla has come a long way since 2018.

So there will be good and bad with all and all will advance for some time to come, but my money is on the fact that CCS plug will change in some way over the next 20 years.
 

saturnschildren

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Warning, potentially unpopular opinion here...

Tesla is going to come crashing back down to earth.
I tend to think this as well for many of the reasons posted above, but I think that there is another point that should be made: it's been clear for some time now that Elon is a toxic CEO and is entirely happy running equally toxic workplaces (multiple discrimination lawsuits at Tesla & SpaceX, his current behaviour at Twitter, etc) but until recently there hasn't been a lot of competition for his engineers (both hardware and software). I wouldn't be at all surprised if Tesla starts losing all sorts of valuable staff to the larger automakers as the market for personnel experienced in EV development gets more and more competitive. This "brain drain" could be just as damaging to Tesla as all the other forms of competition mentioned above.
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