Do NOT Plug a 48A Connector into a 50A outlet to charge your EV.

[Lytning]

Regardless of what Codes allow, we need to monitor how our specific installation is reacting. I had a Licensed Electrician install a 50 amp circuit breaker and 14-50 receptacle in my garage for the Mobile Charger. When the Charge Station Pro arrived, I had the electrician install a plug on the CSP and connected it to the 14-50 receptacle. He set the CSP at 40 amps per Code allowance. The plug temperature was running at ~100 degrees F and the circuit breaker at ~120 degrees F when charging. Since I can allow charging to complete overnight, I reset the CSP to 32 amps. The plug temperature dropped to ~80 degrees F and the circuit breaker to ~100 degrees F during charging. I sleep better at those temperatures. Estimates to upgrade my electrical system to allow CSP 80 amp charging where in the $12,000 to $16,000 range.

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[Maquis]

are you saying the ford mobile connector doesn't derate automatically based on the plug end? Tesla does this with the dongles. 50 amp dongle will only draw a max of 40 amps. 30 amp dongle will only draw 24 amps etc.

Yes, but it only comes with 2 dongles, a 14-50 and a 5-15.

 

[Maquis]

Regardless of what Codes allow, we need to monitor how our specific installation is reacting. I had a Licensed Electrician install a 50 amp circuit breaker and 14-50 receptacle in my garage for the Mobile Charger. When the Charge Station Pro arrived, I had the electrician install a plug on the CSP and connected it to the 14-50 receptacle. He set the CSP at 40 amps per Code allowance. The plug temperature was running at ~100 degrees F and the circuit breaker at ~120 degrees F when charging. Since I can allow charging to complete overnight, I reset the CSP to 32 amps. The plug temperature dropped to ~80 degrees F and the circuit breaker to ~100 degrees F during charging. I sleep better at those temperatures. Estimates to upgrade my electrical system to allow CSP 80 amp charging where in the $12,000 to $16,000 range.

It’s been a while since I reviewed them, but I believe the installation instructions for the CSP specify hard-wire only, no cords.

 

[Kev12345]

Aren’t all EVSE’s required to be hardwired?

 

[Amps]

Aren’t all EVSE’s required to be hardwired?

No, lots of them come with 14-50P/6-50P cordsets.

 

[Maquis]

I wonder how long ago that standard was written and if changes are due to it now that 50+ amp chargers are getting fairly common.

Given how many melted 14-50s I’ve seen pictures of, I highly doubt higher amperage receptacles will be allowed for EVSEs.

 

[Kev12345]

No, lots of them come with 14-50P/6-50P cordsets.

Wouldn’t the EVSE already derate itself to 40 amps then if it came with a 50 amp plug?

 

[Maxx]

For a 15’ run, I’d go ahead and run a 50A circuit. It’s not going to increase the cost that much. That will allow you to use the supplied Ford Mobile Charger, if needed.

By run a 50 Amp circuit, you mean the fuse and wiring for 50 Amp in addition to 14050 box?

I didn't order the Ford mobile charger. I got a J+ Booster 2 instead. It is 40 amp but it can go as low as 6. The problem with my hesitation to go above 24 amps is that the property is a prefab home on a camp ground. Everyone else has only 60 amp service but I got lucky and have 80 amps. I have no hope of that ever going over 80. Currently this runs a 25 amp (240) water heater that can come on anytime. 20 amp (240) HVAC that can come on any time, 30 amp (240) dryer I can keep off while charging and a bunch of other appliances like toaster and microwave. So I am at the edge of my limits. I figured I just charge instead of laundry and I should be OK. Do you still think I should have a 50 amp circuit for charging?

 

[Maquis]

By run a 50 Amp circuit, you mean the fuse and wiring for 50 Amp in addition to 14050 box?

I didn't order the Ford mobile charger. I got a J+ Booster 2 instead. It is 40 amp but it can go as low as 6. The problem with my hesitation to go above 24 amps is that the property is a prefab home on a camp ground. Everyone else has only 60 amp service but I got lucky and have 80 amps. I have no hope of that ever going over 80. Currently this runs a 25 amp (240) water heater that can come on anytime. 20 amp (240) HVAC that can come on any time, 30 amp (240) dryer I can keep off while charging and a bunch of other appliances like toaster and microwave. So I am at the edge of my limits. I figured I just charge instead of laundry and I should be OK. Do you still think I should have a 50 amp circuit for charging?

Gotcha….I didn’t realize you didn’t get an earlier Lightning that came standard with the mobile charger.
Keep in mind that those amp ratings you quote are breaker sizes, not actual current draw. Water heaters have 4500 watt elements which equates to 18.75A. Dryers typically draw between 20 and 22A. Your HVAC will likely be 16A or less - check the nameplate.
The NEC has a method for calculating load for dwelling units. If you ask a licensed electrician for a quote, they should perform a load calc and tell you the maximum you should install according to to it. That said, the NEC calcs are very conservative and my gut feel is that you’d be fine adding a 50A circuit. If you do, you can always charge at a lower rate unless you really need to charge faster in an unusual case.
If you’re worried about it, you could run 50A wire to a 14-50 receptacle, but install a 30 or 40A breaker and set the charger at not more than 80% of the breaker. This commonly done all the time - most electric ranges are equipped with a 14-50 plug and are powered by a 40A circuit.

 

[Lightning Rod]

Thanks for the heads up. I have a 400amp service to my house, so the electrician said using a 60a in one of the panels is no problem

I have a small 1700 sq ft colonial home and I have a 100A box in my basement for all of my outlets and AC and clothes dryer. A coworker told me that I can just have the 100A box removed and install a 200A box to replace it. From the new 200A box, add a 100A breaker and run the 6 AWG copper wire to my detached garage 30 ft away, take the 100A box and install the 100A box in my garage. From that 100A box in garage, install the Charge Station Pro. He said changing my home to 200A service is as simple as changing the box to 200A box. Is it that simple, or does the power company need to run and extra line to my house to enable 200A service? He said the new 200A box will take what it needs from the pole to make my home have 200 amp service. Is it that simple or will extra line(s) be need to be added to my home?

@Ostrichsak and anyone else with knowledge.

Thanks for anyone's help on this matter.

 

[Maquis]

I have a small 1700 sq ft colonial home and I have a 100A box in my basement for all of my outlets and AC and clothes dryer. A coworker told me that I can just have the 100A box removed and install a 200A box to replace it. From the new 200A box, add a 100A breaker and run the 6 AWG copper wire to my detached garage 30 ft away, take the 100A box and install the 100A box in my garage. From that 100A box in garage, install the Charge Station Pro. He said changing my basement box to 200A service is as simple as changing the box to 200A box. Is it that simple, or does the power company need to run and extra line to my house to enable 200A service? He said the new 200A box will take what it needs from the pole to make my home have 200 amp service. Is it that simple or will extra line(s) need to be added to my home?

@Ostrichsak and anyone else with knowledge.

Thanks for anyone's help on this matter.

Changing the panel from 100A to 200A does not upgrade your service. Chances are, the meter and service entrance wiring are only good for 100A.
You need to have a qualified electrician perform a load calculation to see if you need to upgrade your service.
If he says you need to upgrade, he’ll then contact your utility to see what they need to change to go to 200A.

 

[Lightning Rod]

Changing the panel from 100A to 200A does not upgrade your service. Chances are, the meter and service entrance wiring are only good for 100A.
You need to have a qualified electrician perform a load calculation to see if you need to upgrade your service.
If he says you need to upgrade, he’ll then contact your utility to see what they need to change to go to 200A.

Thank you. This is what I thought. That just sounded way too easy to be true.

Thank you.

 

[Shady]

ya ya ya its so simple

First you got to find out how many amps are available though your meter and if its not 200+ amps you need a new meter and that can be as simple as your electric company swamping in a new one or having to replace the wires from the pole/transformer to your house.

Next you have to have install the new box or have it done. Then have the electric company come out and disconnect service so the wires you connect to the new box are not live. This can be as simple as they stand there and wait for you to connect the 2-3 wires from the meter to your new box or it can be we will kill service and be back next week to make it live.

I am sure in some places you will have to get permits pulled.

Nothing is ever as simple as it seems.

 

[Kev12345]

ya ya ya its so simple

First you got to find out how many amps are available though your meter and if its not 200+ amps you need a new meter and that can be as simple as your electric company swamping in a new one or having to replace the wires from the pole/transformer to your house.

Next you have to have install the new box or have it done. Then have the electric company come out and disconnect service so the wires you connect to the new box are not live. This can be as simple as they stand there and wait for you to connect the 2-3 wires from the meter to your new box or it can be we will kill service and be back next week to make it live.

I am sure in some places you will have to get permits pulled.

Nothing is ever as simple as it seems.

where in the western world would you NOT have to get a permit to do a service upgrade?

 

[Maquis]

where in the western world would you NOT have to get a permit to do a service upgrade?

There are many rural US areas where there are no permits. If I need to replace the service at my farm, I couldn’t get a permit if I wanted one. When I had the service installed, the electric coop set a pole with the transformer and combo meter/main breaker. The meter section is sealed and I accessed the main breaker compartment to run service conductors to my panel.

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