White House releases plan to build nationwide network of 500,000 EV chargers

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

It’s a big $30 million dollar shopping center, owned by one of my clients who told me he spent a ton of time negotiating the deal to install them. They’re definitely full scale Super Chargers and the deal was to offer them free to the public.

The management company who runs it is also a client and he stressed to me that they were free (at least for now… he’s actually selling the shopping center in the near future so there’s no guarantee it will remain free).

The key point here is that even if I tried it and it worked, until Tesla makes a real DC adapter, it would still run like a (slower) AC charger.

For any other paid SuperCharger, it simply wouldn’t turn on because it won’t recognize the VIN number.

At this point, I mainly charge my Mach-e at home these days. It’s faster than most of the AC chargers I’ve seen outside. DC charging is so much faster, but not possible at home, but then again, when you’re home, it doesn’t matter how slow it is, you run it at night and start off each day at 100%.

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[PungoteagueDave]

It’s a big $30 million dollar shopping center, owned by one of my clients who told me he spent a ton of time negotiating the deal to install them. They’re definitely full scale Super Chargers and the deal was to offer them free to the public.

The management company who runs it is also a client and he stressed to me that they were free (at least for now… he’s actually selling the shopping center in the near future so there’s no guarantee it will remain free).

The key point here is that even if I tried it and it worked, until Tesla makes a real DC adapter, it would still run like a (slower) AC charger.

For any other paid SuperCharger, it simply wouldn’t turn on because it won’t recognize the VIN number.

At this point, I mainly charge my Mach-e at home these days. It’s faster than most of the AC chargers I’ve seen outside. DC charging is so much faster, but not possible at home, but then again, when you’re home, it doesn’t matter how slow it is, you run it at night and start off each day at 100%.

A $30 million shopping center is not big and would not typically have a Supercharger - There are exceptions, but my grocery-anchored centers are mostly valued well above that point. Think $200/ft these days - so a stand-alone Super Walmart is worth roughly $25 million with no other tenants.

Of course Superchargers are free to the public - Tesla pays all the electrical costs - the power does not come from the center and the center is not involved with providing power at ANY Supercharger - so does not control access beyond making the initial agreement. The shopping center has nothing to do with it beyond the easement agreement. I have seen many of these agreements at centers in which I have investments.

You are correct with respect to third parties using Superchargers - a point I have been making on the Tesla forums - they won't work at high speeds with other marques because they are optimized for Supercharging only with Tesla technology inside the cars. The landside chargers are the magic - Supercharging bypasses the chargers inside the car, even in a Tesla, and dumps power direct to the battery. No other EV is set up to handle this the way Tesla does it, so at least for now, using a Supercharger in a Lightning or Porsche will be akin to hooking up to a Level 2 charger anywhere else - slow and silly. Bad for Tesla in my view because it blocks charging pylons with slow chargers. The interesting news is that Tesla is using CCS connectors at its newest Superchargers in Texas - may be a harbinger of moving to that as a standard. It already uses CCS in Europe due to regulations there requiring use of that standard. https://electrek.co/2021/12/23/tesla-applies-install-supercharger-stations-texas-ccs-connectors/

 

[EaglesPDX]

Stopped at local Freds this AM and there on the lot, a built ready to go EA four charger setup.

What was a bit unique was they were all pull throughs to the point, someone with a trailer could use them, three out of the four.

 

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

…You are correct with respect to third parties using Superchargers - a point I have been making on the Tesla forums - they won't work at high speeds…

…The interesting news is that Tesla is using CCS connectors at its newest Superchargers in Texas - may be a harbinger of moving to that as a standard. It already uses CCS in Europe due to regulations there requiring use of that standard. https://electrek.co/2021/12/23/tesla-applies-install-supercharger-stations-texas-ccs-connectors/

That’s the key to making them actually useful to non-Teslas. I have a TeslaTap, just in case I travel someplace where there is only a Destination Charger, but thus far, I’ve never used it. The $260 I paid for it is just insurance, but the real magic comes from DC (CCS connector) charging so circling back to the original post showing a Mach-e at a SuperCharge…. Even if it works, it’s only working at AC speeds.

When they finally open that network up, they will need a DC adapter to make it useful. According to Tesla the second hurdle is still working out how to manage payments. They changed their App recently to make that possible, and they’re testing it at one location in Europe, where they don’t need an adapter anyway.

 

[FXDR131]

It's all about control.

 

[TF1000]

When my employer offers a "free" charging station I'll seriousely consider trading in my 5.0 F150 for a Cybertruck ...I mean Lighning.

Until then... with my "off again, on again "green" power grid, I'll be buying that $5.00+ a gallon gasoline.

Sorry folks... what "we want to be" and "what IS" hasn't merged yet.

Personally I'm not buying another ICE vehicle until my employer offers free gasoline.

 

[EaglesPDX]

Even if it works, it’s only working at AC speeds.

I thought it was limited to 50kW which is roughly 200 mph charging which is not bad.

 

[FXDR131]

Some day some of us will may be buying grain and making our own ICE fuel to retain our freedom of travel. Be aware.

 

[Sapphire]

Some day some of us will may be buying grain and making our own ICE fuel to retain our freedom of travel. Be aware.

Why not just generate your own electricity?

 

[TF1000]

Why?
Have they already shut down all the Gas Stations where you live?

Cause my employer does offer free EV charging (2 Clipper Creeks and 1 Tesla) but doesn't offer free gasoline. Closest gas station is 10 miles away.

 

[FXDR131]

Why not just generate your own electricity?

My motorcycles don't run on electrons.

 

[Sapphire]

My motorcycles don't run on electrons.

Mine does. If this is for a future when ICE vehicles are not being sold to control travel through electricity rationing and you have to make your own gasoline or diesel, you’ll be scaveninging to keep vehicles going? Seems scavenging for EVs would work too since that’s what the world will be using. Plenty of parts, and fewer moving parts for EVs.

 

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

I thought it was limited to 50kW which is roughly 200 mph charging which is not bad.

AC chargers are slower and they get SUPER HOT when you increase the power. The first time I charged at home with an AC charger configured with a 60 Amp circuit, which can give me about 37 miles per hour, my Mach-e sounded like it was an airplane about to take off. I had to step down the amp settings until a firmware update fixed it so the fans didn’t run at full RP…. But then again, it’s colder outside, so it’s possible the loud fans could still kick in next summer.

That said, DC charging bypasses the transformers entirely so they can push a lot more power without fear of overheating the transformers in the car.

The bottom line is that SuperChargers are SUPER FAST… because they use DC, so if the Mach-e in the original post is using a TeslaTap or similar AC adapter it’s kinda pointless because those adapters are still AC, basically turning the SuperCharger into a Destination Charger.

However, if they had a closeup of the connector, I would love to know if they managed to get their hands on the DC adapters that Tesla claims are on the horizon.

One of the best things about the F-150 Lightning is that the extended range batter actually charges FASTER than the standard range, because it basically charges the second battery independently at the same time.

I’m not sure if I’ll get that Extended Range battery. I think it’s pretty expensive and I’ve gotten used to having a 210 mile range. I charge at home and start each day with a LOT more power than I need for the Day. I’ve only needed a longer battery once on a long trip, but I found a DC fast charger along the way and had a nice snack while it charged back to about 80%.

 

[MickeyAO]

they won't work at high speeds with other marques because they are optimized for Supercharging only with Tesla technology inside the cars. The landside chargers are the magic - Supercharging bypasses the chargers inside the car, even in a Tesla, and dumps power direct to the battery. No other EV is set up to handle this the way Tesla does it

Tesla uses the exact same Pulse Width Modulation (PWM) from the Battery Management System (BMS) to tell the EVSE (do I really need to spell this out or are we all good on what this means?) what level of current it wants. All DC charging is straight to the battery bypassing the onboard charger (OBC). I have tested many BEV vehicles, including Tesla, and they all follow the SAE (sorry, I forget the number right now) protocol on the amount of current to supply based on the PWM from the BMS. So what "magic" did I miss in my testing?

 

[BigPaulie]

Good luck with that! This country has a 50-70 year old energy grid. People in major cities can't run air conditioners in summer. More fantasies from DC!

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