Massachusetts - Vehicle to X Program

[Danface]

I got an email from Sunrun asking for the vehicle VIN.
I cannot do the FCSP. I have tried and given up getting that on the WiFi. I hope that doesn't become a showstopper.

They have to have other options but I guess we will see.

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[JvdMaat]

They have to have other options but I guess we will see.

I'll find out at 13:00 today when they are (hopefully) coming over to check out my house.

 

[Danface]

I'll find out at 13:00 today when they are (hopefully) coming over to check out my house.

The person who came (Joey) was really good!

 

[JvdMaat]

The person who came (Joey) was really good!

I'm getting Corey (Electrical Designer).

 

[Danface]

I'm getting Corey (Electrical Designer).

Let us know how it goes please. So far it seems like it's well run.

 

[Danface]

I just a notification from National Grid
"During extremely hot days, there are temporary changes to your energy use that can lower costs and reduce the stress on the electric grid between the peak afternoon and early evening hours (3 p.m. – 8 p.m.)." Makes me wonder should I just plug the truck into the genrator plug and run the house from from it for a few hours so just skip the whole V2G thing all together!

 

[JvdMaat]

Let us know how it goes please. So far it seems like it's well run.

It was both Joey and Corey. They confirmed Sunrun is doing the install. And that it will be the FCSP with HIS. But then TMH will do a software layer over that...
He also thought it would be a newer model of the FCSP. So even if you have one, it'll get replaced.
They are going to be working on an FAQ as they are getting the same questions from many of their visits (and most of the people they visit are engineers, IT, etc. Geeks and nerds)
They also confirmed cohort 2 went out yesterday, and they are visiting the first one on their way back to the office.
They are meeting with the utilities only once a month, next this Thursday and will ask about rates (buy/sell). But it sounds like there is pressure on the utilities and they want to make this happen.
They also said that car manufacturers are a big part of this. Many declined to be involved, and Ford is the most advanced in this area (bi-directional charging).

 

[JvdMaat]

I just a notification from National Grid
"During extremely hot days, there are temporary changes to your energy use that can lower costs and reduce the stress on the electric grid between the peak afternoon and early evening hours (3 p.m. – 8 p.m.)." Makes me wonder should I just plug the truck into the genrator plug and run the house from from it for a few hours so just skip the whole V2G thing all together!

I just got an Eversource ConnectedSolutions peak event warning. They will lower my AC now, and then raise it a few degrees from 15:30-20:00. It's gonna be a scorcher.
They expect a large peak to happen from 3-8 with everyone coming home from work and turning on their AC.

 

[Danface]

It was both Joey and Corey. They confirmed Sunrun is doing the install. And that it will be the FCSP with HIS. But then TMH will do a software layer over that...
He also thought it would be a newer model of the FCSP. So even if you have one, it'll get replaced.
They are going to be working on an FAQ as they are getting the same questions from many of their visits (and most of the people they visit are engineers, IT, etc. Geeks and nerds)
They also confirmed cohort 2 went out yesterday, and they are visiting the first one on their way back to the office.
They are meeting with the utilities only once a month, next this Thursday and will ask about rates (buy/sell). But it sounds like there is pressure on the utilities and they want to make this happen.
They also said that car manufacturers are a big part of this. Many declined to be involved, and Ford is the most advanced in this area (bi-directional charging).

That's "comforting" because from my point of view the issue with HIS is no one owns the "entire stack". It's just like when you have a problem with some software, the vendor tells you to call Microsoft and Microsoft tells you to call the vendor. I wonder if they will let us keep whatever TMH overlays after the pilot is up?

 

[JvdMaat]

That's "comforting" because from my point of view the issue with HIS is no one owns the "entire stack". It's just like when you have a problem with some software, the vendor tells you to call Microsoft and Microsoft tells you to call the vendor. I wonder if they will let us keep whatever TMH overlays after the pilot is up?

I asked, and they do not know. So come Dec 2026 we may just have the "basic" Ford HIS system.
We may or may not be able to continue the V2X (which would require TMH or equivalent). That is also unknown, and depends on success of the program, and potential push from (state) govt.
And there will also not be a transfer switch. After the demo I plan on installing that (if possible) so we can switch from grid (when it's down) to truck and do V2H at least. That's what the HIS was made for, and that's the part we won't get But that should be low cost compared to the full system.
I would love to be able to V2H during the day for home use, and feed all my solar to the grid (plus whatever V2X they want) to gain maximum peak rate sales, and then recharge the truck at night. Pipe dreams
And if they keep this (V2X) after 2026, since we have the base infrastructure, it would make adding home batteries a no brainer to add to the stack for H2X (Home to everything.).

For this demo, they will own the stack, and it sounds like support is there from all the stakeholders and vendors to make this happen. He also said Sunrun was invested in this and put their best people on it.. (Likely cause they hope this will open up to the wider public in 2027?)
But come 2027... Who knows.. Welcome to being guinea pigs.

 

[Danface]

I asked, and they do not know. So come Dec 2026 we may just have the "basic" Ford HIS system.
We may or may not be able to continue the V2X (which would require TMH or equivalent). That is also unknown, and depends on success of the program, and potential push from (state) govt.
And there will also not be a transfer switch. After the demo I plan on installing that (if possible) so we can switch from grid (when it's down) to truck and do V2H at least. That's what the HIS was made for, and that's the part we won't get But that should be low cost compared to the full system.
I would love to be able to V2H during the day for home use, and feed all my solar to the grid (plus whatever V2X they want) to gain maximum peak rate sales, and then recharge the truck at night. Pipe dreams
And if they keep this (V2X) after 2026, since we have the base infrastructure, it would make adding home batteries a no brainer to add to the stack for H2X (Home to everything.).

For this demo, they will own the stack, and it sounds like support is there from all the stakeholders and vendors to make this happen. He also said Sunrun was invested in this and put their best people on it.. (Likely cause they hope this will open up to the wider public in 2027?)
But come 2027... Who knows.. Welcome to being guinea pigs.

Do you have Pro Power? That's my "HIS" and all I need to do is plug in the truck, turn off the main, 200 AMP breaker, slide the little piece of metal that pevents the 30 AMP, 240 Volt breaker from the truck from being on at the same time as the main breaker and switch the 30 amp breaker on. It's not automated so there's no one to blame but me if doesn't work (and I like it that way! )

BTW, Sunrun and Ford need to keep best people on it, this kinda thing is a moving target so, unlike the above mentioned low budget HIS, it's never just "done".

 

[JvdMaat]

Do you have Pro Power? That's my "HIS" and all I need to do is plug in the truck, turn off the main, 200 AMP breaker, slide the little piece of metal that pevents the 30 AMP, 240 Volt breaker from the truck from being on at the same time as the main breaker and switch the 30 amp breaker on. It's not automated so there's no one to blame but me if doesn't work (and I like it that way! )

No Pro Power. So that won't work.
In a pinch I can plug the fridge and freezer in extension cords to the truck. But that's about it.
I have a 4kW stand-alone propane generator right now for power outages. But the 20lbs propane tanks only last about 12 hours.

 

[f150lex]

I asked, and they do not know. So come Dec 2026 we may just have the "basic" Ford HIS system.
We may or may not be able to continue the V2X (which would require TMH or equivalent). That is also unknown, and depends on success of the program, and potential push from (state) govt.
And there will also not be a transfer switch. After the demo I plan on installing that (if possible) so we can switch from grid (when it's down) to truck and do V2H at least. That's what the HIS was made for, and that's the part we won't get But that should be low cost compared to the full system.
I would love to be able to V2H during the day for home use, and feed all my solar to the grid (plus whatever V2X they want) to gain maximum peak rate sales, and then recharge the truck at night. Pipe dreams
And if they keep this (V2X) after 2026, since we have the base infrastructure, it would make adding home batteries a no brainer to add to the stack for H2X (Home to everything.).

For this demo, they will own the stack, and it sounds like support is there from all the stakeholders and vendors to make this happen. He also said Sunrun was invested in this and put their best people on it.. (Likely cause they hope this will open up to the wider public in 2027?)
But come 2027... Who knows.. Welcome to being guinea pigs.

Are you saying V2H isn’t enabled? Are you sure? thought that was the point the X in V2X. Otherwise it’s just V2G.

 

[JvdMaat]

Are you saying V2H isn’t enabled? Are you sure? thought that was the point the X in V2X. Otherwise it’s just V2G.

Sorry, I just got more info back; V2H is included, but only to shed load, or other online actions. It will not be enabled in case of grid loss. (Though I will be asking about that now)
Here's their FAQ based on common questions from the first 10 site assessments: (Questions from Joey, answers from TMH)

1. Will my new bi-directional charger be able to support uni-directional charging for an EV car of a different model?
   - Yes, your bidirectional charger will be able to unidirectionally charge another EV as long as the charge port conforms to that EV’s plug type. For example: Ford F150 Lightning vehicles have a CCS plug, and the Wallbox, Sunrun HIS, and Ara come with CCS plugs. The Tesla EV would require a NACS adaptor to charge using those chargers, but a Chevrolet Bolt EUV would be able to charge normally without needing an adaptor.

1. i.e. some Ford 150 Lightning owners, also have a Tesla or other EV model as a secondary vehicle. Can they use the Dcbel Ara, HIS, Wallbox, etc.. to charge their other vehicle?
   - No answer here, this is my answer: RecentlyA2Z released: CCS1 Charger to NACS Vehicle | AC | Only For Ford Pro Charger Only | T – A2Z EV . But I imagine that won't do bidirectional since the FCSP uses DC for the V2X part

1. Will the charger be utilized for power my home (V2H) on a daily basis to reduce grid load, or will it only be utilized to support V2G during peak demand periods?
   - The MassCEC V2X Demonstration Project will prioritize using V2G (exporting to the home only, no grid-export) to reduce demand during peak periods. However, there may be use cases we explore that involve exporting to the home on a daily basis to shed load.
2. Will the customer be able to opt out of V2G if they are away for vacation? Or will they have to make other travel arrangements and leave the car home? What is the user flexibility?
   - Yes, you’ll be able to opt out of participating in any of the V2G events using The Mobility House’s notification system. Please note: you do not need to be home if there is an event taking place. As long as your EV is plugged in, it can participate in V2G events.
3. Two customers have Tesla Power Walls (battery storage) participate in the Virtual Power Plant program, i.e. Connected Solutions, and receive compensation from the utilities for their available battery storage. Can they remain in this plan and be part of the V2G program? If not, will the V2G program incorporate their Tesla Power Wall battery capacity as an add-on to their available vehicle capacity?
   - Let’s confirm this with the utilities…I’m not entirely sure. To specify—did they say they were enrolled in ConnectedSolutions/can you ask specifically which program they’re enrolled in?

 

[JvdMaat]

Just heard back from TMH. Ford Lightnings can only discharge using the HIS system and FCSP.
(So solutions like the dcbel ara won't work with the Lightning)
Which is unfortunate, cause after looking at the dcbel ara on their site, it looks a solid generation ahead of the HIS.
They're also saying this would be part of Connected Solutions (similar to some of you who have home batteries and are enrolled in Connected Solutions with those):

Unfortunately, we aren’t able to discharge the F-150s using the dcbel Ara because Ford has partnered with Sunrun to create the Home Integration System. That HIS is the only system on the market that can pull power from the Ford F-150 Lightning to provide whole-home backup and on-grid load shed. With a Ford F-150, we’ll have to award you the Sunrun HIS instead of the dcbel Ara to make sure you can participate using V2G.
As a part of the program, Sunrun had to confirm that they had the capability of discharging while grid-connected. TMH has experience connecting with charger clouds to optimize EV charging/discharging and plans to have MassCEC awardees participate in programs like Connected Solutions to show the value of V2G in Massachusetts.

They are also looking into options of joining: Clean Peak Energy Standard | Mass.gov
ISO New England
(For year round benefit of V2G, instead of just Connected Solutions summer peak events)

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