Auto sensing for Travel charger/connection

[fhteagle]

he can only do a 30 Amp breaker.

If he installs a NEMA 14-30R receptacle ("outlet"), you can buy a 14-30P (plug) to 14-50R adapter. This would let you plug in the 14-50 end of the EVSE, but does not guarantee the EVSE knows of the correct amp limit for the circuit.

The OpenEVSE can be purchased with a 14-X plug that will fit in 14-30, 14-50, or 14-60 receptacles .

I know for sure the OpenEVSEs can be permanently or temporarily set to any amp limit between 6 (minimum J1772 spec) and the physical limits of the wiring and relay in the OpenEVSE. OpenEVSEs are not cheap, but are absolutely worth every penny, easily repairable, and the firmware is under continuous improvement.

The Ford travel charger is made by Webasto, yes? AFAIK those units take their limits from which plug pigtail is put in them. Does Webasto make/sell a 14-30 plug to Webasto proprietary pigtail?

Sponsored

 

[Henry Ford]

There's a lot of good information here but it's probably more in depth than it needs to be.

If you want to use the Ford Mobile Charger to charge your truck at 240V/30A you must install a 40A or 50A circuit with a 14-50 outlet.

There are chargers that will charge at lower amperage and the Ford Mobile Charger will work with 120V.

If it were me, I'd install a 50A circuit and charge when the load on the rest of the house is low. This is a perfectly safe approach to the problem. If you exceed 60A on the main breaker, it will trip. It's also the cheapest option outside of 120V charging... which might be a good option too.

 

[chl]

Yellow band on Ford Mobile Power Cord means it is limited/derated to 30A although the label on it may still say 32A max (mine does).

The 240V dongle has a 14-50P on one end to plug into a 14-50R (P= Plug and R=Receptacle).

I had an EVSE that used a 6-50R (GE WattStation) and I wired it for 40A back in the day (2011).

To use the FMPC, I got a heavy duty adapter to mate the 14-50P to the 6-50R. Works fine.

That said, there have been a number of FMPC failures, so I keep mine in the truck for emergencies on the road, and use a different EVSE at home (a Ford Charge Station Pro).

If you wire up a 14-50R on a 40A circuit, the code would like you to put a label on the receptacle that indicates it is a 40A circuit and not a 50A circuit so that somewhere down the road someone doesn't over load it.

 

[hturnerfamily]

yes, it really would be nice to have 'auto amperage sensing' for many electric devices, tools, etc., to make life in the EV world easier - but, at this point in history, there is no physical or electric/electronic method to automate the process of identifying the 'maximum power' to any breaker, circuit, or outlet. This would demand the ability to 'trip' a breaker to find it's maximum output, and, well, that would defeat the purpose, all together.
A breaker is not an electronic device, at least the vast 99.9% in American homes and businesses, so the prospect of finding a solution is daunting. Tesla, the original Nickola, may have had a thought on this, but we've never seen his answer, if so.

Amazingly, our LIGHTNINGS do have the ability - we have an electronic 'fuse' that operates in the place of a typical breaker, for our ProPower output. You can see this when you exceed the ProPower output of any outlet, or set of outlets: the power just goes dark.
When you need to restart ProPower, you don't have any physical BREAKER to reset, but you have a 'button', or fuse, to push, to reset, in the bed outlet location. This electronic 'fuse' is also why our ProPower is so sensitive to overload, whereas a more common BREAKER would probably not trip so quickly - it requires HEAT as it's concern. Heat within the breaker is what controls it's tripping mechanism. A sudden over-amperage is probably not going to heat it up too quickly, or it's wiring, so it tends to be more forgiving when sudden amperage needs are only for a quick second, such as the start of a compressor.

An EVSE with an 'autosensing' feature would be a BOON for the majority of EV owners, ESPECIALLY those who struggle with understanding the amperage issues that they have to be aware of, or the inability to easily modify or install needed circuits, wiring, breakers, and outlets.

 

[chl]

The current capacity of a circuit is dependent on certain physical parameters including wire size, type of insulation, size of conduit and number of conductors in the conduit as well as the breaker size when installed.

If those parameters were programmed into a communication device when the circuit was installed, say a smart service panel, then conveyed to a smart tool when first plugged into the circuit, then it could be accomplished. Communications signals can be sent over regular electrical lines, the utilities sometimes do that.

The conveying of circuit capacity is in essence what the J1772 communication between the EVSE and the vehicle do.

Assuming the EVSE has been wired correctly (using the 80% rule) it will not exceed the maximum current draw of the circuit.

The EVSE J1772 protocol is as follows (Supply Equipment is the EVSE, PEV is the Plug-in Electric Vehicle):

1) supply equipment signals presence of AC input power
2) vehicle detects plug via proximity circuit (thus the vehicle can prevent driving away while connected) and can detect when latch is pressed in preparation for plug removal.
3) Control Pilot (CP) functions begin
3a) supply equipment detects plug-in electric vehicle (PEV)
3b) supply equipment indicates to PEV readiness to supply current and modulates the signal indicating to the PEV how many amps it can supply *
3c) PEV ventilation requirements are determined
3d) supply equipment current capacity provided to PEV
4) PEV commands energy flow
5) PEV and supply equipment continuously monitor continuity of safety ground
6) charge continues as determined by PEV
7) charge may be interrupted by disconnecting the plug from the vehicle

*The control pilot signal enables basic communication between the EVSE (charger) and EV (electrical vehicle): The charger sends the information about its maximum charging current in the form of a 1 kHz ±12 V pulse-width modulated (PWM) signal to the electric vehicle.

----

 

[hturnerfamily]

"If those parameters were programmed into a communication device when the circuit was installed..."

yes, but the idea of a 'pure' autosensing plug-n-play EVSE doesn't exist because, well, you would have to PROGRAM it TO the breaker size/wire size/outlet size , first... sure, that is a HUMAN intervention, but the OP really wants a purely 'automatic' design: it doesn't exist.

There are many devices on the market for monitoring/controlling/sensing CIRCUITS, wires, etc., but they are designed for the size of the circuit, to begin with... requiring human intervention.

I would love to see a device that allows one to simply plug it into ANY outlet to see what 'max amperage' and 'voltage' the outlet/circuit/breaker is... that would be a breakthrough. Right now, though, we have to look at the combination of the outlet type, the wire size, and the breaker - the 'lowest amperage' of these is the limiting factor, or, better said, the 'max amperage' determination.

 

[chl]

"If those parameters were programmed into a communication device when the circuit was installed..."

yes, but the idea of a 'pure' autosensing plug-n-play EVSE doesn't exist because, well, you would have to PROGRAM it TO the breaker size/wire size/outlet size , first... sure, that is a HUMAN intervention, but the OP really wants a purely 'automatic' design: it doesn't exist.

There are many devices on the market for monitoring/controlling/sensing CIRCUITS, wires, etc., but they are designed for the size of the circuit, to begin with... requiring human intervention.

I would love to see a device that allows one to simply plug it into ANY outlet to see what 'max amperage' and 'voltage' the outlet/circuit/breaker is... that would be a breakthrough. Right now, though, we have to look at the combination of the outlet type, the wire size, and the breaker - the 'lowest amperage' of these is the limiting factor, or, better said, the 'max amperage' determination.

Yes a smart service panel in a smart house would be needed. Right now we rely on smart humans, which is why there are never house electrical fires anymore, eh?

No matter how smart a system is, some dumb human will come along and find a way to cause a problem - so says Murphy.

Sort of like the way the railroad switches trains from track to track and of course they NEVER have accidents because the engineers driving the trains override the controls, now do they? Or because of communications errors in the switches? Or random computer fluctuations cause by solar flares?

Sponsored