Looking to put together what's needed for a charger install

[RSMLightning25]

Hey Guys,

I have a buddy in electrical supply that I can source parts to install a charger at my place. I am simply trying to get a parts list together and I'll run the wire and conduit but have an electrician hook everything up.

Looking at a Tesla universal wall connector or a charge point home flex so I can a rebate from the electric company. I see the Tesla will accept up to 4 awg and the flex at 6 awg. I will have a run of right around 100ft as my power is on the other side of my house and I need to run to a detached garage. looking at 4 and 6 awg thhn, the needed breakers and what not. I've been looking at threads here and reddit posts on what I need but it looks like installs are not that consistent.

Any help you guys can provide on what all I need to procure would be great.

Thanks! - Richard

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[P-38]

I would ask the electrician who is going to connect everything because they will have an opinion and are responsible for the install.

Going out on a limb that your 2025 is not a fleet truck so you only need 48 amps of charging max. This will mean a 60 amp circuit. If you use Romex then you need 4awg if you use thhn then 6awg is ok given the run length. Or there are exceptions and other nuggets of wisdom strewn through out the code as well as the inspectors preference(they might made you use 4awg even if code allows 6awg) so it should be the electrician who is terminating And pulling the permit who gives you a BOM that you then procure.

 

[PJnc284]

No two installs are the same so it varies as you've found. As suggested above, discussing it with the electrician would be best as there are a lot of questions. What is your main panel capacity? Is the detached garage already powered? Assuming you have the capacity it might be worth running a larger line to a subpanel in the garage and then adding the charger. Are you planning to route through a crawl space and then trench to the detached garage?

 

[RSMLightning25]

My main capacity is 200 amp with room for additional breakers. The detached garage is powered with wire running in the attic to the other side of the house and then underground back up into the garage. I would route the new wire through the attic as well and then trench to the garage as you mentioned. I definitely would like to run to a sub panel for this install.

 

[P-38]

Then so many variables come into play with a sub panel...how large, future uses...more code rules with underground...

While I have the knowledge to parse thru I am not an electrician and don't feel comfortable suggesting a BOM for this project. Best of luck.

 

[RSMLightning25]

Then so many variables come into play with a sub panel...how large, future uses...more code rules with underground...

While I have the knowledge to parse thru I am not an electrician and don't feel comfortable suggesting a BOM for this project. Best of luck.

Thanks! I'm just in research mode at the moment for talking points for when I get an electrician out. Just wanting to educate myself as much as possible before the come out.

 

[K6CCC]

My opinion here. Although it may cost more, use conduit and THHN wire rather than Romex. Makes it FAR easier to make some change down the road. Also whatever size you NEED of conduit, put in at least one size larger - especially since your conduit run is moderately long. If there will be more than two 90 degree bends, put an intermediate pull point (pull box or condulet). Yes, code allows 360 degrees of bend, but with larger wire, much cursing will be avoided by keeping the number of bends down.

Also a trick from an electrician friend, if you have condulet at a bend, use one size larger condulet and put reducers to the conduit. This is particularly true when using larger size wire. For example from my main to my garage sub-panel, code required 1.25 inch conduit. I put in 1.5 inch conduit, but for each of several condulets, I put in 2 inch condulets with reducers to the 1.5 inch conduit. Made pulling the large 2 AWG wire far easier. The difference in cost for the larger conduit and condulets was easily worth it in my time and effort saved. The inspector liked it too.

 

[RSMLightning25]

Thanks for the note. I see what you mean after some googling. Makes sense to me. I want to do this once and for it to be appropriate. I'll try to keep the 90 degree bends to a minimum but, I am thinking there will be at least 4 throughout the run. I do want to use THHN over Romex

 

[K6CCC]

Sometimes you have little or no choice on number of bends. In the case of my main to sub-panel, there are five condulets and three 90 degree bends and one 45 degree bend. When I had the new concrete poured for my driveway (a good 15 years ago), I knew the plan was to put a sub panel in the garage. My electrician told me I needed a minimum of 1.25 inch conduit, so I put in about 20 feet of 1.5 inch PCV with a 90 bend at each end under the driveway before the concrete was poured. I stubbed up each end with my best guess as to where it needed to be. A decade later I did the major project to replace the main and add the sub panel. Turned out that at the main end, my best guess was about a foot off, so I put a condulet on the stub, about a foot of conduit and another condulet to go up into the new main. At the garage end, there is a condulet at the top of the stub out of the concrete and then all of 6 inches or so of conduit that pokes through the wall into the garage and then another condulet to go up the wall via a 45 degree bend, then a 90 degree bend to go over the two feet to the top of the sub panel. Lastly another condulet into the top fitting of the sub panel. Note that for the conduit inside the garage, I just used 2 inch conduit rather than reducers.

Note that because when I put the conduit in below the driveway, I did not have an electrical project in progress, and therefore no permit. So I just photo documented the living daylights out of the conduit run so that I could prove that the conduit was deep enough to meet code. When I had the sub panel project inspected, I told the inspector that I had photos to prove that the top of the conduit was 22 inched below the bottom of the concrete (4 inches more than required), he believed me so I did not need the photos. It does help when you get along well with your inspector!

 

[RSMLightning25]

Yeah, I'll need this to be all up to snuff for inspection and whatnot. I just want it done right and do have a consult with an electrician tomorrow to see where things should go from here. I appreciate the insight and experience you have shared with me.

 

[hturnerfamily]

this is like asking what's the best way to run plumbing water lines... pex? pvc? hard lines? flex lines? push-to-connect fittings? Sharkbite fittings? Galvanized? Copper?

you're going to get 9 different 'ways' from 7 different people... and, you'll quickly find out, too, that no two electricians will even do it the same way.

for me, it's not that difficult: it's little different from your 240v electric water heater, or your 240v electric dryer, or your 240v electric stove/oven/range... or your 240v HVAC or mini-split, etc. Electricians do this stuff in their sleep every day - don't sweat it.

A) the size of wiring is important, but the size of the breaker is the most - it cannot be oversized. It is your safety measure.
B) the size of wiring should be a higher gauge than your EVSE maximum amperage draw requires - as constant HOUR after HOUR of 30, or 48, or 80 amp power draw is very substantial
C) whether you use one type of wire or another is not high on the checklist - it depends much on the location, interior or exterior, length of run, underground/above ground exposed, in conduit, etc.
D) fully set, and fully torque, all connections - check and re-torque all these connections after several charging sessions - even at the breakers

I've used conduit before, with SOOW cable.
I've used Underground -rated wiring , buried.
I've used SOOW exposed and run along under the soffits.
I've had short runs from the main panel, to runs of hundreds of feet.
I've done this many times, and many various locations and situations.

The EVSE you choose is not important, your vehicle will not care.
A low-cost 240v 30amp Adjustable works just fine, with a NEMA 14-50 outlet.
Your LIGHTNING's Ford Mobile EVSE will work just the same.
Personally, I stay away from the expense and permanence of HARD-WIRED EVSE choices, since this corners you into a specific location, and you're not able to move it or take it with you, easily...

 

[RSMLightning25]

Thanks for your input on the matter. All of your points make sense to me. Once I get advised on my current panel capacity I'll decide on what direction to take. Luckily I work from my place so I don't worry about charging speeds but, once I get rid of my 2018 5.0 I want to be able to comfortably charge at home without relying on the mobile charger.

 

[Joe Dablock]

Also, put a 100 amp sub panel in your garage. Then you have options without going back to your main panel in your house. You can easily add a second EV charger or add a 220v plug that you can plug a portable charger into.

 

[Adventureboy]

Lots of good advice here. I'd add one thought: If your main panel can support it, you might want to plan for a second EV at some point in the future. If you can, size your cable/subpanel to the garage to support this. I ended up with 2 EVs in short order. Many smaller EVs only need 16 or 24 amps, while our trucks are a bit more power hungry at 40 or 48 amps. Eg., a 40/16 amp combination would need an 80 amp subpanel. Your electrician can help with the calculations.

 

[chl]

Hey Guys,

I have a buddy in electrical supply that I can source parts to install a charger at my place. I am simply trying to get a parts list together and I'll run the wire and conduit but have an electrician hook everything up.

Looking at a Tesla universal wall connector or a charge point home flex so I can a rebate from the electric company. I see the Tesla will accept up to 4 awg and the flex at 6 awg. I will have a run of right around 100ft as my power is on the other side of my house and I need to run to a detached garage. looking at 4 and 6 awg thhn, the needed breakers and what not. I've been looking at threads here and reddit posts on what I need but it looks like installs are not that consistent.

Any help you guys can provide on what all I need to procure would be great.

Thanks! - Richard

Check with your electrician and see what local codes require, but this would be my guesses for a permanent install if you want to estimate what the materials cost might be.

Going underground in conduit and assuming only a 60A circuit, for the hots and neutral you would need a minimum #6 AWG copper THWN, THWN-2 or XHHW-2 wire - underground wire has to be water resistant even if in conduit which is what thw "W" stand for. The ground wire would be smaller, minimum #8 AWG.

NOTE: if you are just installing an EVSE, you most likely do not need a neutral - I was thinking you might go with a 60A sub-panle or have a neutral for future work.

However, if your run is over 100ft, the wire needs to be larger due to the resistive voltage drop, larger means a lower AWG number, so #4 AWG minimum for hots and neutral, #6 AWG minimum ground wire.

You also need a conduit of the proper size - there are conduit fill charts you can refer to, and the fill depends on various factors. For ease of wire pulling, use a size larger than the minimum, it will cost a few bucks more but it is worth it for making the install go faster.

If you want a sub-panel and future possible expansion, you'd probably want a 100A panel for the sub. Then the wire would be larger of course, #3 AWG minimum copper for hots and neutral or #2 AWG copper if the run is long with #4 AWG ground. Larger conduit as well.

Our electrician wired a shed for us, back in 1999, that was about 60 feet from our house and we used three #2 AWG (hots and neutral) and #4 AWG (ground), the panel was unbonded and at the time only one ground rod was required - the local code says two now. The electrician miswired the panel connecting a hot where the neutral should have been leading to my 120V drill being fried by 240V when I plugged it in - so be sure yours checks all the voltages when he is done!

Also sub-panels have to be unbonded, that is the neutral should not be bonded (connected) to the panel metal case - there will be a bonding screw or wire that can be disconnected to effect the unbonding - refer to the panel install instructions.

Also, the detached garage sub-panel will need ground rods installed, code here requires 2 rods six feet apart.

Those are things to be sure your electrician knows and does.

Details, details, details.

As I said, the above is only my guess based on my experience with a similar install many years ago.
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Disclaimer

I am an electrical engineer but not a licensed electrician.

The information provided in this post is provided for information purposes only and does not constitute any endorsement or recommendation. No warranty, expressed or implied, is made regarding the accuracy, adequacy, completeness, legality, reliability, or usefulness of any information found in this post. It is your responsibility to verify and investigate this information.

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