Nano-Particle Flow Batteries As The EV Battery of the Future?!

[Jim Lewis]

Interesting, fairly in-depth article in IEEE Spectrum on "flow" batteries that use replaceable charged nano particles. You pull up to a "gas" station, the spent fuel electrolyte is removed and replaced with fully-charged nano particle electrolyte. The article claims a much higher energy density is possible than with Li-ion. The technology is supposedly being developed out of a DARPA project, as the military can't see rolling with classic batteries that charge slowly and are heavily (pun intended) built into vehicles, etc.

Probably another technology that will always be just around the corner (10 years off...).

Can Flow Batteries Finally Beat Lithium? - IEEE Spectrum

Sponsored

 

[MickeyAO]

Manager; Flow batteries have too low energy density to be considered for EVs, how do we generate buzz for our product?
Engineer; The very nature of redux flow makes it better suited for grid level, not vehicle level.
Marketing guy; We just need a new buzz word...how about nanoparticles?

I got my start in the energy storage field in flow batteries 14 years ago (spent 2 years working on them before I moved over to the Energy Storage Technology Center...different Divisions at SwRI).
Nanoparticles were first looked at 14 years ago. DARPA invested in it 10 years ago. This is way more than 5 years out (see my thoughts in previous post on fuel cells that were 5 years out when I joined the military in 1983).

 

[Jim Lewis]

I had a related thought on the grid backup vs. EV vehicle aspect.

Even if the following were true, you'd still have the problem of where you regenerate the fuel:

Katsoudas adds, Influit is now developing a battery with an energy density rated at 550 to 850 watt-hours per kilogram or higher, as compared to 200 to 350 Wh/kg for a standard EV lithium-ion battery. The company expects larger versions would also beat old-style flow batteries at backing up the grid because the nanoelectrofuel can be reused at least as many times as a flow battery—10,000 or more cycles—and it will probably be cheaper.

See my OP post for the link to the spectrum.ieee.org article.

Unless you regenerate fuel right at a filling station, you have to waste a lot of energy lugging charged fuel to filling stations and hauling away the spent fuel to regenerate. That cost is not taken into account by a strict energy density comparison of battery types. By contrast, high-voltage electricity can be transported efficiently to charging stations wherever. Perhaps, though, if gas stations could also offer nanoparticle fuel, especially in rural areas, that might be an easier development path than filling in all the gaps in country-wide DC fast charging.

Grid backup batteries might be so big that it might pay to have a nanoparticle regenerating station on site with a big grid backup battery so you wouldn't be lugging "fuel" around the countryside.

 

[Yellow Buddy]

Interesting, fairly in-depth article in IEEE Spectrum on "flow" batteries that use replaceable charged nano particles. You pull up to a "gas" station, the spent fuel electrolyte is removed and replaced with fully-charged nano particle electrolyte. The article claims a much higher energy density is possible than with Li-ion. The technology is supposedly being developed out of a DARPA project, as the military can't see rolling with classic batteries that charge slowly and are heavily (pun intended) built into vehicles, etc.

Probably another technology that will always be just around the corner (10 years off...).

Can Flow Batteries Finally Beat Lithium? - IEEE Spectrum

Super interesting read. Swapping electrolytes..will Gatorade work in a pinch?

 

[Yellow Buddy]

I had a related thought on the grid backup vs. EV vehicle aspect.

Even if the following were true, you'd still have the problem of where you regenerate the fuel:

See my OP post for the link to the spectrum.ieee.org article.

Unless you regenerate fuel right at a filling station, you have to waste a lot of energy lugging charged fuel to filling stations and hauling away the spent fuel to regenerate. That cost is not taken into account by a strict energy density comparison of battery types. By contrast, high-voltage electricity can be transported efficiently to charging stations wherever. Perhaps, though, if gas stations could also offer nanoparticle fuel, especially in rural areas, that might be an easier development path than filling in all the gaps in country-wide DC fast charging.

Grid backup batteries might be so big that it might pay to have a nanoparticle regenerating station on site with a big grid backup battery so you wouldn't be lugging "fuel" around the countryside.

Agree 100%

That’s going to always be a problem. We need to “lug” the fuel around due to lack of infrastructure. Gas stations are just storage tanks, no different than onboard fuel tanks.

In the same manner, battery swap stations, flow stations are just bigger battery packs. The more abundant, the less we need to carry on our own but they still need to get out there. Whether that’s being lugged physically or transmitted by wire - at least until the infrastructure for generation improves.

Gasoline, diesel, propane, natgas all still need to be lugged. Electric has to go through lines, but we have cheap enough on site generation options nowadays that need to take off. Use of micro grids, solar, wind - especially in rural areas would go a long way. It doesn’t even have to be dedicated just opportunistic. There’s still loss, but not as much as lugging or transmitting it from offsite.

..just an uneducated opinion

 

[queuewho]

Super interesting read. Swapping electrolytes..will Gatorade work in a pinch?

Brawndo is better

 

[Danface]

Thank you guys!! It's not surprising (and really great) to see geeky folks buying electric vehicles!

 

[Yellow Buddy]

Thank you guys!! It's not surprising (and really great) to see geeky folks buying electric vehicles!

Speak for yourself. I only read about this so I can feign interest so I can lure the geeks to the nearest locker.

Sponsored