Tripping Pro Power breaker with 120v welder

[GrokTime]

It said overload (or something to that effect). When I push the power button it tries to start but then cuts off. Every time.

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[Maquis]

It said overload (or something to that effect). When I push the power button it tries to start but then cuts off. Every time.

That sounds like the welder has too much inrush current at startup for PP to handle.

 

[GrokTime]

That sounds like the welder has too much inrush current at startup for PP to handle.

Yes, but someone suggested to use the 30 amp outlet with an adapter. I am not sure how that would work. I am looking to understand this aspect better.

 

[hturnerfamily]

I'm not sure that this is actually anything to do with 'tripping' because of high amperage, and it may be more about the GFCI aspect of the Lightning's electrical design - it is VERY sensitive, even though it may 'work' at times, for some amount of time, and sometimes not at all...

for instance: I use the ProPower from the bed, on my 9.6kw set of outlets, which, actually, have been tested to be 30amps of power, each set, since they are powered by the SAME wires that power the 30amp 240v twist-lock outlet... so....

it's not the 'power' that's any issue - my camper won't be drawing anything NEAR 30amps, probably nothing more than 2-3 while we are traveling down the road. And, I also dropped the ground from the extension cord between the truck and the camper, to prevent the normal 'GFCI' issues...

and, under 'normal' conditions, it works just fine..... well, at least until you ask for the microwave, or the roof air conditioner... the GFCI immediately has an issue, and FAULTS off.

what???

No, it's not about the 'amperage' you are drawing, but there IS something to be said about the combination of AMPERAGE and the GFCI Sensitivity issue from the truck. Again, without the microwave or air conditioner, it works just fine for everything else.

Interestingly, I performed some tests, and found a realization of how to 'rectify' this GFCI issue:

-UNPLUG the camper's 7-pin trailer connector from the truck
-UNCOUPLE the camper from the truck's ball

now... everything, including microwave AND the roof air conditioner, work perfectly, AT THE SAME TIME, while still connected to the truck's ProPower.....

I took time to make another TEST: I plugged the camper into the house's external GFCI outlet. The outlet immediately faulted.
I then plugged the camper into the house's external REGULAR outlet, and the camper worked PERFECTLY, with no issues, even if using the high-amperage appliances, all at the same time.
Go figure.


so, yes, there are very sensitive issues with the truck's GFCI ... bonded Neutral... unbonded Neutral... or whatever you want to call it... but, there are generally ways around it.


I will say that MY issue, providing power to my camper, is partly to do with the design of the camper, as well - meaning that the manufacturer's wiring scheme on the camper's main panel is suspect: there is something within this wiring/electronics that does not work well with the grounding of the camper to the truck, or when the camper's trailer cord is plugged into the truck's 7-pin trailer outlet.

As for the issue of the OP's WELDER, I suspect that the internals of the WELDER is part of the issue. ProPower 'sees' proper connection, and may power the WELDER, until, at some point, the wiring does NOT stay in line with ProPower's expectations. But, who knows why. You might try another WELDER and have no issues at all.

 

[GrokTime]

I tried my small log splitter again in both the frunk and the bed. The attached picture shows the result. This does not look like a GFCI issue does it? I was thinking of trying the 240 volt outlet with an adapter, but I have read in other threads that the 120v outlets can actually provide up to 30 amps, so I am not sure this would make a difference.

I am very disappointed that the Pro Power on board cannot run this simple device. It runs fine on a home 15 amp outlet.

 

[hturnerfamily]

I think it's hard to understand and figure out these issues, but it's also fair to assume that the ProPower is very sensitive to over-amperage, since it is electronically driven, and not 'heat' sensitive, like your home's regular outlet. Your home outlet some built-in leeway to not trip immediately because of a spike in amperage, etc., but only due to CONSISTENT over-amperage.

Try some other smaller devices or appliances from your ProPower outlet. You may find that they work just fine.

 

[Maquis]

Yes, but someone suggested to use the 30 amp outlet with an adapter. I am not sure how that would work. I am looking to understand this aspect better.

It won’t make any difference, IMO. All of the outlets have the same level of protection. There is a thread on here where a 30A measured load ran successfully on one of the 120V receptacles. I’ll see if I can find the thread.

Edit: See post 9 in this thread:
https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/outlet-power.20306/

 

[Ragman]

Now that I'm a Truck Guy™, I decided I needed to learn how to weld. So I went to harbor freight and got a small welder and convinced my diesel mechanic buddy to show me the ropes.

The unit I bought had a pretty short extension cord, so I figured I'd just plug it into the bed outlets and we could practice in the driveway. However, as we were going over the basics, the welder only work for a few seconds before Pro Power decided it was drawing too much current and turned off.

Based on his facial expression, I could tell that my teacher was unimpressed with my high-tech truck. He suggested I get an extension cord and plug it into the house. I assured him that this wouldn't work either, since we'd be plugging into a 15A breaker. Of course, it worked fine. The expression returned.

Dear readers, I'm not sure how to understand this. The welder pulled enough current to alert the Pro Power software, but somehow not enough current to trigger a 15A breaker.

Has anyone run into this before?

You are spiking above 30 amps on start-up, the truck has a software side breaker where a conventional manual breaker allows for this surge before tripping- the truck does not.

Turn on your Pro Power screen and watch the power spike while your buddy runs the welder. You should see it ramp up and trip on the screen.

 

[v2h8484]

It looks like high inrush/startup surge current is the issue. The outlet adapter is unlikely to help. But an inline soft starter may help.

 

[Newton]

I just ran into this same problem and I am hoping someone can help clarify for me what my options are for buying an L14-30P to 6-20R adapter.

I bought a Harbor Freight electric log splitter and it can't be run off the 110 outlets in the back of my lightning because it keeps tripping the circuit. The log splitter says it is 15 AMP so I figured the 20 amp outlets would be fine.

I don't understand the above advice for using the 30 amp outlet with an adapter that does not step the voltage down. Can someone explain it to me? I am don't really understand. Thanks.

To simplify a great deal, AC is alternating current which is a wave, meaning that if you measure the voltage at a 120V outlet to neutral you will see the voltage range from +120V to -120V and all points in between, including 0V.

In (US, residential) systems there are two waves on “hot“ wires that are exactly opposed to each other, so that when one line is at +120V the other line is at -120V. If you measure the voltage between these two hots at this time you will see total distance between the two, which is 120V+120V = 240V. So the voltage between the two hot wires ranges between 240V and -240V while the voltage between the hot and neutral ranges between 120V and -120V.

The reasons that the US has a neutral are historical and related to “selling” the idea of electricity safety when it was first introduced, most of world does it differently.

Practically this means that on a 240V plug, you have two hot wires, a neutral and a ground. If you connect between the two hot wires you can power 240V appliances, if you connect between either hot wires and neutral you can power 120V appliances.

 

[Runaway Tractor]

Omg some of y'all are making this way to complicated. The screen literally says it tripped off due to overload. The GFCI has nothing to do with that. If it tripped due to ground fault, it would say that.

This is very simple. The locked rotor inrush current of the log splitter's electric hydraulic pump motor is overloading the circuit exceeding 30 amps. The end. Same thing happens when trying to start an air conditioning compressor with a heavy inrush current.

There is no easy or inexpensive way to mitigate this effect. A soft start unit used mainly for air conditioning compressors might work on it, but they're not really designed for that purpose so YMMV. Also, that would cost more than the log splitter didn't begin with. Using an adapter to split the 240v outlet will not help either. It's the same circuit as the 120v outlets.

The reason it works fine on house outlets is because the circuit breakers in your panel are far less sensitive and far more forgiving. They don't usually trip on inrush current, and require a more sustained overload condition to trip. The electronic overload protection on the F150 Pro Power is instant and unforgiving.

Bottom line, your electric log splitter is not going to work on the lightning's pro power as designed. Probably should have gotten a gas splitter.

 

[GrokTime]

Thank you. That clears things up quite a bit. However, how do I get a plug that I am sure is only connecting between 1 hot and the neutral? And will it make a difference to my problem? My understanding is that all the bed outlets are capable of supply 30 amps, so I am guessing that even if I can connect my wood splitter to the 240 outlet that it will still trip the circuit.

 

[GrokTime]

Bottom line, your electric log splitter is not going to work on the lightning's pro power as designed. Probably should have gotten a gas splitter.

Well that is disappointing. I have been trying to avoid gas tools and I thought the lightning would be helpful in this regard.

 

[Runaway Tractor]

Thank you. That clears things up quite a bit. However, how do I get a plug that I am sure is only connecting between 1 hot and the neutral? And will it make a difference to my problem? My understanding is that all the bed outlets are capable of supply 30 amps, so I am guessing that even if I can connect my wood splitter to the 240 outlet that it will still trip the circuit.

Using an adapter to split the 240v outlet into two 120v outlets will not help either. It's the same circuit as the 120v outlets right next to it. You're exceeding 30 Amps with inrush current no matter how you wire this up.

This is the adapter we're talking about. But again, this would give you the same thing as as the two 120v outlets already right there. https://a.co/d/inmnCbb

 

[GrokTime]

I just thought I would follow this up. To recap, I bought an electric log splitter from Harbor Freight that I was planning to run off my Lightning. The log splitter would make a brief noise and then kill the circuit. It worked from a regular house outlet however.

First, although I was warned this would work, out of curiosity I tried it with an adapter on the actual 30 amp outlet. Everyone was right, it killed that circuit too.

So I returned the splitter to Harbor Freight and bought a very very similar unit from Ryobi. This one works fine off the regular outlets in the bed of my lightning. Not much more money either.

So, as was suspected, it appears that the cheap harbor freight splitter was drawing way to much power upon startup, or doing something else that the Lightning didn't like.

Thanks for all the help. I am not sure what this says about Harbor Freight stuff! ;-)

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