Chinese EV owners aren’t range obsessed.

[Jseis]

After driving the Lariat ER since July of ‘23, I am so over range anxiety.

https://www.theautopian.com/chinese...dy-figured-out-they-dont-need-huge-batteries/

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[Scorpio3d]

After driving the Lariat ER since July of ‘23, I am so over range anxiety.

https://www.theautopian.com/chinese...dy-figured-out-they-dont-need-huge-batteries/

I think the reason they don’t have anxiety is they probably have much better charging networks which includes not only more locations, but higher charging rates and vehicles that charge at higher rates!
If we had 800 V architecture, I assume that would cut our charging rate in half or maybe a third I don’t know! They also aren’t driving massive bricks. If we all drove model Y or Maverick sized vehicles we would get the same range on 100 kWh or 140 kWh battery.

If people say, ‘We need more and more range,’ that’s because they don’t drive electric cars,” she says. “When you drive an electric car, you realize 700 kilometers [434 miles] is enough. When I drive, even 600 kilometers [372 miles] is enough.”

If we got somewhere in that range, I think most people would be fine. I have no idea what their climate is like compared to ours, but I would assume it would be somewhat similar depending on where you lived just as it is here!

 

[chl]

This is why the original Nissan Leaf had a range of around 100miles on a full charge (a 24kWh battery):

"According to data released by the Department of Transportation, Americans travel about 33 miles per day on average...."

I still have my 2012 Leaf and it was and still is perfect for commuting and putting around local driving even with about 85% battery capacity now after 14 years. No maintenance, no failures, no HV battery issues, nor with the 12v on a battery maintainer. No software glitches. The only bad thing that happened was AT&T dropped 2G and 3G so it doesn't communicate with the web anymore.

Some older Leaf owners are upgrading their 24kWh batteries for triple the size 72kWh for under $8,000 installed. We also have a Prius for the few long trips we might take now and then, so I don;t see the need.

I also had a 2001 Ranger for hauling stuff, but I longed for an electric EV pickup, hence the Lightning.

I would have been fine with a smaller EV pickup, but the Lightning was all there was in my price range (under $50k).

The 2023 Lightning Pro with the SR battery and its 200-250 mile range is fine for my needs so far.

The Chinese company SAIC has a pickup that goes for about $33k USD in the UK with around 200+ miles range called the Maxus T9:

https://en.saicmaxus.com/index.shtml

If they could sell it for that in the US I'm sure they'd do well.

 

[chriserx]

If they could sell it for that in the US I'm sure they'd do well.

Without tariffs and a slightly warmer climate, no doubt.

 

[Jseis]

My typical day is 93 miles. I might drive 1000 miles once a year. Or 230-240 miles once or twice a year. So a 300-320 range works for me. Plus more charging station access really helped.

One interesting cultural change since the 60’s is a steady increase in vehicle commuter miles and long recreational travel by vehicle, thus vehicles with larger gas tanks and more efficient engines (not all cases though).

A 60’s 3/4 ton truck with a V8, 4:11 gears & 4 speed was good for 10 mpg. W/20-24 gallon tank behind the seat, well 200 mile range… maybe. My Bug w/10 gallon tank and 32-34 mpg could barely get 300 miles range.

The rise of 35 gallon tanks plus efficient diesel engined trucks began pushing truck range to 500-600 miles. Even towing at 12-13 mpg, a diesel 3/4 ton might get you over 400 miles of range. Thus the rise of owners with $100K rigs towing $100K trailers wanting to lay down 300 miles before lunch to grab their favorite rec site & chest bump talk about their rigs. And hot shot haulers. Twin tanks weren’t that uncommon for big V8s in the 70’s.

And then there are jobbers tool packing on a long haul job (think welders) and there becomes a significant group of high mileage users well served by long distant vehicles.

My range is variable cause seasons and rural speeds. Thus 270-300 winter and 320-340 summer suits me fine. And I’m solidly in that 300-320 average range but rarely need it. Since we’ve no freeways within a 100 miles & speeds in excess of 60-65 mph and 70+ are 130-150 miles away, that speed impact to range is rare Focus but common for most US vehicle owners as most us residents live within 5 miles of a freeway.

But the market drives sales and buyers will waste $$$ on range despite not needing it/rarely needing it and coupled with a lack of charging options… well here we are.

Since we came within inches of buying a $20K 2WD Maverick that pushed 40mpg highway… and hybrid versions are somewhat close on similar mileage… I can see the appeal to dealers ($$$ for maintenance!) and buyers “value“ complexity (makes no sense) In spite of their needs.

Here we are.

op

 

[mr.Magoo]

While I don't suffer from range anxiety, I still don't know if it makes a whole lot of sense to compare the US to other countries, let alone China.

The US have a long history with cars and gas is (relatively) cheap so driving anywhere is always an option, and longer trips are not uncommon as a result of that.

I doubt many people in China would load up the family and drive 500miles for a weekend getaway or 1300miles for a week in their equivalent of Florida, they'd fly or take the train.

 

[brewski]

Before owning my Lighting, I never gave much thought as to how little I drive when I'm home. I drive to the airport about 4 times a month (80m each way). When home, driving around town just doesn't use that much power...BUT if you plug in every night you really don't even think about it. I do have to think about my airport runs as I charge to 100 for those.
The US manufacturers have been more obsessed with marketing hands free driving instead of the actual convenience of electric.

 

[Heliian]

I doubt many people in China would load up the family and drive 500miles for a weekend getaway or 1300miles for a week in their equivalent of Florida, they'd fly or take the train.

China is infamous for its holiday traffic, they have massive freeways.

 

[WXman]

Apples to bananas.

Cars and trucks can't be compared. The U.S. culture and Chinese culture can't be compared.

If Chinese buyers needed trucks to do jobs that required long distances, or needed to pull campers long distances, and enjoyed recreation out in the wilderness, they would be complaining about range just like we do.

 

[PJnc284]

China is infamous for its holiday traffic, they have massive freeways.

That gives me anxiety just looking at it

 

[MaintGrl]

That gives me anxiety just looking at it

Reminds me of the SF Bay bridge morning commute

 

[mr.Magoo]

China is infamous for its holiday traffic, they have massive freeways.

I think you're missing my point a little bit, I didn't say that China / the Chinese doesn't have the means to do it or that they don't do it at all, I'm just saying that culturally a car is not the goto option for long(er) distance travel.

 

[Athrun88]

I think you're missing my point a little bit, I didn't say that China / the Chinese doesn't have the means to do it or that they don't do it at all, I'm just saying that culturally a car is not the goto option for long(er) distance travel.

I'd be interested in how many people who are commenting about Chinese/Asian transit systems/preferences have actually been to those countries. Having been to China, Korea, and Japan; I can confidently say that if you are travelling any appreciable distance, you either take a high-speed train, bus, or fly. The mentality of driving long distance just doesn't exist in as a wide spread way as in North America. Even in rural parts of Korea (where I'm from), rail and bus connections are done so well that you wouldn't drive further than 50km if you even had a car. Going from rural to urban, the way the various transit options are interconnected (subway, low speed rail, high speed rail, taxis, buses, etc...) are also done so well that you really don't need/want a car in the city. I'm not saying that people *don't* drive long distances, because clearly they do per the picture above, but it's not generally the default choice.

 

[Mal106]

During the gas shortages I was driving a Datsun pickup and had a young family. I added an additional 20 gal tank. That gave me about 900 miles of range. When I look back at it, we stopped often enough and long enough that we would have had time to charge my 123KWH Flash. Unfortunately when I travel today, and stop to charge I stop at many chargers that don't have what a family would need nor are the chargers nearly as close to my line of travel as were the stops I made in the Datsun.

My charging stops are based on mainly price which has evolved into almost exclusively Tesla. I am truly disappointed that charging is not more competitive in price so I could give more priority to other things.

At my age 3 to 400 miles is a days drive so one or 2 charges is normal. I think and plan in miles charging to 20 or so miles over the range I need to the next charger or the hotel. Range is no longer a problem Facilities, cost (competetion) and time need improvement. I long for the sign: Premium $3.09, Plus $2.79, Regular $2.59 and E $.30. I doubt I'll see it.

 

[Jseis]

I’ve been to Japan & Korea and used both countries high speed rail to travel between urban areas/ports. Also used local subway and light rail. Having lived in LA and Seattle in era before any serious mass transit, it was obvious what those countries had to do to get their population moving. Surface grade roads in their urban areas. Yikes!

As vehicle ownership costs show no end in upward growth, less costly vehicles have a market and that sector will grow.

What stunned Farley about China is their manufacturing prowess and advanced technological advancement. Way beyond the US.

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