Charging Speeds at Home

[chl]

@chl

Chris,

Mach-E and Lightning Mobile EVSEs are the same except for the pigtail.

If the pigtail for your mobile Ford OEM EVSE has a piece of yellow tape on it, then it is limited to amps. If no tape then it is the 32 amp version.

The Lightning's ProPower 240vac output can handle 30 amps continuous , unlike a typical home dryer outlet which is code limited to 80% of circuit rating for continuous use.

Tesla has multiple cords that will change the output of their mobile connectors. I have a 14-30P plug version for my Tesla Mobile Connector that plugs into my 4-wire 30 amp dryer outlet and limits the Tesla Mobile ESVE output to 24 amps.

Here is a picture of a 30 amp Lightning pigtail.

Thanks, I never noticed any yellow tape on my pigtail/240V dongle. I'll have to dig it out and look again. EDIT: yes you're right, yellow tape on the 240V dongle!

I have an adapter from the 14-50P on the FMPC dongle to my 3-wire (6-50) receptacle that I used for the FMPC when I was using it before I got a FCSP. Since the FMPC does not use the neutral in 240V mode, it works with a 3-wire outlet.

My GE WattStation bought way back in 2011 for my 2012 Nissan Leaf was a plug-in version and had the 6-50P.

About the ProPower 30A, the NEC code actually exempts generators from the 80% rule under certain conditions: they are allowed to run at full rating if they are protected from overloading, otherwise cables must be 115% of generator rating.

NEC 445.13 (Generator - Ampacity of Conductors)
“The ampacity of the conductors from the generator terminals to the first distribution device(s) containing overcurrent protection shall not be less than 115 percent of the nameplate current rating of the generator…”

“Exception: Where the design and operation of the generator prevent overloading, the ampacity of the conductors shall not be less than 100 percent of the nameplate current rating of the generator.”

The ProPower on-board is for all intents and purposes a generator. It must have a bonded neutral because of OSHA requirements for generators.

OSHA standards require that a portable generator used on a worksite have a bonded neutral. 29 CFR Sec. 1926.956(c).
https://www.osha.gov/laws-regs/regulations/standardnumber/1926/1926.956.

One thing people seem to miss is that if you are powering your house with the Lightning ii should be grounded and have a continuous grounding conductor through the whole system. Some people cut the ground to avoid the "nuisance trips" (which are really ground Edit: LOOP indications not nuisance trips).

Separately derived system (4 Pole ATS)
–Generator neutral bonded to system ground at the generator
–Generator frame requires equipment grounding connection to ATS
Grounding electrode(s) needs to be “nearby”

Anyway, kind of drifting off-topic so I'll stop here.

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[flyct]

Thanks, I never noticed any yellow tape on my pigtail/240V dongle. I'll have to dig it out and look again. EDIT: yes you're right, yellow tape on the 240V dongle!

I have an adapter from the 14-50P on the FMPC dongle to my 3-wire (6-50) receptacle that I used for the FMPC when I was using it before I got a FCSP. Since the FMPC does not use the neutral in 240V mode, it works with a 3-wire outlet.

My GE WattStation bought way back in 2011 for my 2012 Nissan Leaf was a plug-in version and had the 6-50P.

I wish Ford would use the same system that Tesla uses for their Mobile EVSE.

They sell several different Adapter/Dongles for their mobile connectors. Each will automatically reduce the current to a legal level for the receptacle they are plugged into.

In addition to the NEMA 6-15 Adapter and the NEMA 14-50 Adapter that come with it, I bought the NEMA 14-30 Adapter so I can simply plug it into my 240v/30 amp dryer outlet and safely provide a 24 amp (5.7 kW) charge to either my Lightning or my Tesla's if my primary 60 amp hard wired Tesla Wall Connector has issues.


---------------------------------
Description
Maximize your charging options with the NEMA Adapter Bundle. Simply attach the appropriate adapter to your Mobile Connector, plug into the corresponding outlet and begin charging. With all seven Gen 2 NEMA Adapters in one convenient storage bag, you can charge at any available outlet, at home or on the road.
Includes:

• NEMA 5-15 Adapter
• NEMA 5-20 Adapter
• NEMA 6-15 Adapter
• NEMA 6-20 Adapter
• NEMA 10-30 Adapter
• NEMA 14-30 Adapter
• NEMA 14-50 Adapter
• NEMA 6-50 Adapter

Description
Use a variety of household outlets to charge your Tesla with a Gen 2 NEMA Adapter. Simply attach the appropriate adapter to your Mobile Connector, plug into the corresponding outlet and begin charging.

 

[chl]

I wish Ford would use the same system that Tesla uses for their Mobile EVSE.

They sell several different Adapter/Dongles for their mobile connectors. Each will automatically reduce the current to a legal level for the receptacle they are plugged into.

In addition to the NEMA 6-15 Adapter and the NEMA 14-50 Adapter that come with it, I bought the NEMA 14-30 Adapter so I can simply plug it into my 240v/30 amp dryer outlet and safely provide a 24 amp (5.7 kW) charge to either my Lightning or my Tesla's if my primary 60 amp hard wired Tesla Wall Connector has issues.


---------------------------------
Description
Maximize your charging options with the NEMA Adapter Bundle. Simply attach the appropriate adapter to your Mobile Connector, plug into the corresponding outlet and begin charging. With all seven Gen 2 NEMA Adapters in one convenient storage bag, you can charge at any available outlet, at home or on the road.
Includes:

• NEMA 5-15 Adapter
• NEMA 5-20 Adapter
• NEMA 6-15 Adapter
• NEMA 6-20 Adapter
• NEMA 10-30 Adapter
• NEMA 14-30 Adapter
• NEMA 14-50 Adapter
• NEMA 6-50 Adapter

Description
Use a variety of household outlets to charge your Tesla with a Gen 2 NEMA Adapter. Simply attach the appropriate adapter to your Mobile Connector, plug into the corresponding outlet and begin charging.

Nice set of adapters!

I have another mobile EVSE that came with my Leaf made by Panasonic for Nissan EVs, adapted for slightly faster charging (16A) by an aftermarket company in 2012.

My 2012 Leaf can't charge faster than 3.3kW (13.75A) - soon after I took delivery of mine they upgraded the charger in 2013MY Leafs to 6.6kW (27.5A) - I think my salesperson thought it was going to be 6.6kW in mine, but the upgraded charging was delayed a MY. With a 24kWh battery 3.3kW was good enough for my use.

My GE WattStation could be unplugged and taken off the wall, but it maxes out at 30A or 32A (depending on which GE literature you read - I assume 30A but I never checked it) so no point in that.

Can you believe the WattStation cost $1000.00 in 2011?

Still drive it around now and then - battery at about 85% original capacity.

 

[flyct]

Nice set of adapters!

I have another mobile EVSE that came with my Leaf made by Panasonic for Nissan EVs, adapted for slightly faster charging (16A) by an aftermarket company in 2012.

My 2012 Leaf can't charge faster than 3.3kW (13.75A) - soon after I took delivery of mine they upgraded the charger in 2013MY Leafs to 6.6kW (27.5A) - I think my salesperson thought it was going to be 6.6kW in mine, but the upgraded charging was delayed a MY. With a 24kWh battery 3.3kW was good enough for my use.

My GE WattStation could be unplugged and taken off the wall, but it maxes out at 30A or 32A (depending on which GE literature you read - I assume 30A but I never checked it) so no point in that.

Can you believe the WattStation cost $1000.00 in 2011?

Still drive it around now and then - battery at about 85% original capacity.

My first Nissan Leaf was a 2015 with a 24 kwh battery and an 84 mile published range. I bought it from a dealer that was 100 miles way from home. I left the dealership at 9:30 PM with my wife following me in our Lexus Hybrid.

I drove home at 50 mph, with no AC and windows closed on the interstate. After 34 miles I realized I was not going to make it home so I stopped at another Nissan dealership on the way. Fortunately they had a L2 charger so I plugged in and went across the street to McDonalds for 1-1/2 hours and put in about 10 kWhs. When I got home I had 8 miles of range left.

I installed a hard wired Eaton L2 EVSE https://www.balanced-electric.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/EVSE.pdf on a 40 amp circuit at home. It served us well for 8 years and 5 Nissan Leaf's until we went to a 2023 Tesla Model Y. Shortly after we bought our first Tesla I had a Tesla Wall Connector installed on a 60 amp circuit, which we are still using. I was using the Tesla Mobile Connector at our cabin plugged into my 50 amp RV 04-50 outlet for a while. The Nissan Branded Panasonic Mobile EVSE was very robust and reliable. It worked very well at our cabin plugged into the RV outlet.

A Tesla Forum member used my referral code to buy his Model Y and that gave him $500 off and gave me $500 in referral credits to get a free Wall Connector, which I installed at our cabin and to this day I'm still using.

 

[chl]

My first Nissan Leaf was a 2015 with a 24 kwh battery and an 84 mile published range. I bought it from a dealer that was 100 miles way from home. I left the dealership at 9:30 PM with my wife following me in our Lexus Hybrid.

I drove home at 50 mph, with no AC and windows closed on the interstate. After 34 miles I realized I was not going to make it home so I stopped at another Nissan dealership on the way. Fortunately they had a L2 charger so I plugged in and went across the street to McDonalds for 1-1/2 hours and put in about 10 kWhs. When I got home I had 8 miles of range left.

I installed a hard wired Eaton L2 EVSE https://www.balanced-electric.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/EVSE.pdf on a 40 amp circuit at home. It served us well for 8 years and 5 Nissan Leaf's until we went to a 2023 Tesla Model Y. Shortly after we bought our first Tesla I had a Tesla Wall Connector installed on a 60 amp circuit, which we are still using. I was using the Tesla Mobile Connector at our cabin plugged into my 50 amp RV 04-50 outlet for a while. The Nissan Branded Panasonic Mobile EVSE was very robust and reliable. It worked very well at our cabin plugged into the RV outlet.

A Tesla Forum member used my referral code to buy his Model Y and that gave him $500 off and gave me $500 in referral credits to get a free Wall Connector, which I installed at our cabin and to this day I'm still using.

I manage to get 4.8mi/kWh or better if no hills involved local driving in the Leaf but out on the highway, a whole lot less - I don't even take out on the highway anymore or even go over 45mph unless it's down hill.

I recon I have 85% of the 24kWh capacity so around 20.4kWh so maybe 90 to 100 miles range local driving even now. I never charge it even to 80%, mostly keep it around 50%, which is enough to go to our local grocery store (about 1 mile away no hills, but a couple traffic lights) a couple times before adding kWhs...I use the timed charge since you can't select 50% and figured out I could get away with charging about 1.5 hours (adding about 5kWh) at night after the $$ rate goes down which costs me at the worst 21 cents.

I learned to drive to conserve electrons in the Leaf, gradual acceleration and braking. Never use AC or heat, just heated seat and steering wheel when needed.

My 2012 Leaf had an EPA rating of 106 city/92 highway as I recall.

Still like the Leaf for short hops...except I don't use it to drive my son around, he's 6'5" so he is not comfortable in it, lol. I'm 5'8" so fine for me.

 

[ScottC]

i'm sure this is an old thread, but it popped up on my feed so i'm putting my $600 in. I've recently installed a 60amp breaker and the 48V ChargePoint Flex. This jumped my charge from 6.6 w the mobile to 11.5....for my f150 that's a jump from around 13m/hour of charge to about 23m/hour charge at my current 2.x kW driving rate. Very satisfied at this point.

 

[chl]

I set the FCSP to a max current of 48A in FordPass (the max my SR Lightning Pro can accept, although I am wired for 80A for the future should I have a different EV).

I generally see about an 8% loss (lost kWhs that don't get added to the battery) due to various things beyond my control (resistance and other internal and external efficiency losses) using the numbers the FCSP and FordPass provide me anyway.

I also have a 30A GEWattStation (J1772) for the Leaf I could use with the Lightning (if the cord will reach - haven't tried).

With an SR battery and not a lot of driving per day, sufficient for me, and the price is right with at home time of day pricing (over night hours).

 

[cdherman]

I only get around 4 miles/kw with my 2016 Leaf, but I do drive 65 on interstate with regularity. Thats about as SLOW as you can drive safely.

I started off with a Juicebox in 2016 or so, and after a number of years, it fried its relay. Since I liked it because I could easily program how long I wanted to charge, I bought a used one on eBay. Later learned that Juicebox Pros all die in the same spot -- right upper relay input. Probably were not torqued correctly in the factory.

So I learned how to fix this problem, and got to 3 Juiceboxes that were "broken" which I then fixed for $50 relay. I stopped with 3 and the Juicebox has since been orphaned by Enel-X. So the EVSEs are now "dumb", but robust 40A EVSEs.

At my families farm, I keep installing EVSEs here and there for the Lightning and for my RAV4 PHEV when I am out there. Mostly my brother charges at night at his home.. We have the 80A Ford EVSE at his home. If/when we need to charge other J1772 vehicles there, we will just SAW OFF the lower parts of the CCS charger. He only gets 16.2 kw out of the 80A charger though -- I *Think* his street is 3 phase power and his house is 204v. But I have never got around to proving this with a voltmeter.

 

[chl]

I only get around 4 miles/kw with my 2016 Leaf, but I do drive 65 on interstate with regularity. Thats about as SLOW as you can drive safely.

I started off with a Juicebox in 2016 or so, and after a number of years, it fried its relay. Since I liked it because I could easily program how long I wanted to charge, I bought a used one on eBay. Later learned that Juicebox Pros all die in the same spot -- right upper relay input. Probably were not torqued correctly in the factory.

So I learned how to fix this problem, and got to 3 Juiceboxes that were "broken" which I then fixed for $50 relay. I stopped with 3 and the Juicebox has since been orphaned by Enel-X. So the EVSEs are now "dumb", but robust 40A EVSEs.

At my families farm, I keep installing EVSEs here and there for the Lightning and for my RAV4 PHEV when I am out there. Mostly my brother charges at night at his home.. We have the 80A Ford EVSE at his home. If/when we need to charge other J1772 vehicles there, we will just SAW OFF the lower parts of the CCS charger. He only gets 16.2 kw out of the 80A charger though -- I *Think* his street is 3 phase power and his house is 204v. But I have never got around to proving this with a voltmeter.

With my 2012 Leaf I can program in the dash menu the length of time to charge, which is how I roll since I don't usually need to be at 80% or 90%. I have gotten as high as 4.8mi/kWh

My Leaf is limited to 3.3kW (they had said they were going to go to 6.6kW but it didn't happen for another year or so) so a pitiful 13.75A, but it only has a 24kWh battery anyway.

My GE WattStation can charge at 30A so similar to the FMPC but better quality I think, but since I can't get the Lightning in my garage, the cord might not reach from the WattStation out to the Lightning.

I think 3 phase is often 208, but it can also be 240V or 480V among others depending. 16.2kW would be consistent with 208V x 80A, since there is some loss of power through the charging system. There could also be voltage drops on long runs of wire of course.

I get about 92% of the 11.52kW (48A x 240V) my SR battery could handle from the Ford Charge Station Pro, if the numbers FordPass and the FCSP tell me are correct.

 

[MrLoganRoss]

I have a Wallbox charger set at 40 amp. Regardless of car. It gets 9.1 from the grid. The car receives 8.6-8.7.

 

[chl]

I have a Wallbox charger set at 40 amp. Regardless of car. It gets 9.1 from the grid. The car receives 8.6-8.7.

Nominal voltages can vary from the 240V standard, so could be as low as 227V which would give you the 9.1kW at 40A.

But 8.7kW is almost 96% of 9.1kW which seems a bit high efficiency from what is usually had in EV L2 charging, which is usually anywhere from 84%-94%

At 40A x 240V would be 9.6kW and 92% of that would give you 8.8kW

All the numbers we see are what the equipment reports to us, unless we measure them ourselves with accurately calibrated ammeters/voltmeters, etc. which I haven't done. So some deviance may be inherent in the device measurements.

The actual delivered current, e.g., 40A or 48A, from the devices may have some variation as well from the settings.

But it is all close enough.

 

[SmoothJ]

So I usually charge at around 7.2 however today I only been charging at 6.5. Nothing has really changed on either side. The only thing I can think of is the weather since it’s over 85 today. The EVSE itself is around 50C internally and it’s in the garage.

 

[GarageMahal]

Lots going on in this thread but adding my 2 watts... faster at home isnt always better. I have an Emporia EVSE rated and wired for 48 amps but I use the Emporia app to derate it down to 24 amps.

This still gets me fully charged overnight and puts less strain on the grid (and my wires). I can easily dial it back to max any time I need more juice in a hurry.

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