First Time EV Owner - New Emporia Classic at 48A. Is this too hot?

[25StarWhiteLightning]

He finally agreed to wire it with THHN in conduit.

In the end he wired it with 6/3 NM-B Romex with a 60 amp breaker. We had to derate the Wall Connector to 40 amps and replace the breaker with a 50 amp breaker.

He agreed to THHN and then did it in Romex anyway??! Did you make it redo it?

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[flyct]

He agreed to THHN and then did it in Romex anyway??! Did you make it redo it?

It wasn’t my house. I was advising my friend with a new EV who was having HIS new house built. He was acting as his own general contractor and the electrician was a sub contractor he hired.

When he called me and told me that the wire had been run I asked his to verify it was not NM-B Romex and it was actually SE CU cable. He took the picture below and sent it to me. It was NM-B Romex. The drywall wasn’t even up yet.

I told him to have the electrician to rerun it with proper 60 amp wiring, either SEU Copper or THHN in proper conduit while the drywall was still not up. He didn’t want to confrontation so he let it go. He told me later that he was concerned that the electrician would charge him to redo it. A GC wouldn’t have let it go. He’s just a wuss. His standard line is “ I’m not worried about it, it’s good enough”.

 

[K6CCC]

I have my FCSP (set to 48 amps since that's as much as my 2024 Flash will take) wired with 6AWG THHN in PVC conduit (about an 8 foot run from my main breaker panel). Has a 60 amp breaker.
I did the install myself, but I am qualified to do so.

 

[25StarWhiteLightning]

I have my FCSP (set to 48 amps since that's as much as my 2024 Flash will take) wired with 6AWG THHN in PVC conduit (about an 8 foot run from my main breaker panel). Has a 60 amp breaker.
I did the install myself, but I am qualified to do so.

Would you mind measuring some temperatures on the breaker and the FCSP cable after about an hour of full power charging?

 

[K6CCC]

I'm out of town for a few more days, but I can when I get back home.
One note, I always fully uncoil the cable from the FCSP to the truck when I use it because I have to in order for it to reach.

 

[RLXXI]

Ford paid Qmerit for a basic install of 6awg 30' run from panel to charger and a 60A breaker, when he came over for the install, I gave him 4awg tinned copper marine grade cable. Overkill I know but I had the cable already so why not. They supplied all else.

Guy said all EV charger installs should use 4awg in his opinion.

 

[flyct]

Ford paid Qmerit for a basic install of 6awg 30' run from panel to charger and a 60A breaker, when he came over for the install, I gave him 4awg tinned copper marine grade cable. Overkill I know but I had the cable already so why not. They supplied all else.

Guy said all EV charger installs should use 4awg in his opinion.

HUMMM.

It may not be a type that is permitted to be used for NEC applications. But who knows what Louisiana allows. If it passed permit inspection you should be OK.

The following is from the UL Guide Information for "Boat Cable" (BDFX)

This category covers boat cable, which consists of a single insulated conductor without a jacket, or two or more insulated conductors with or without an overall nonmetallic jacket, and which is suitable for use in marine pleasure crafts.

 

[RLXXI]

HUMMM.

It may not be a type that is permitted to be used for NEC applications. But who knows what Louisiana allows. If it passed permit inspection you should be OK.

The following is from the UL Guide Information for "Boat Cable" (BDFX)

We also bury people above ground so there's that lol.

 

[LightningDan]

^^ This is the most concerning part of your post to me. The electrical contractor had to be "convinced" to use the proper wiring? This contractor was part of the Ford Power Promise deal?

As for your temperature, that's completely normal. I have a 60 amp breaker feeding a 48 amp hardwired Emporia through a short run of up-sized 3 awg in EMT conduit. The breaker gets warm, never measured but your observation seems reasonable. The Emporia cable always gets warm, again your observation seems reasonable. I have read that it is best to uncoil the cable while charging. My charger is next to my charge port so I keep my cable in a single large loop so that ther is only one layer of cable while charging to more easily dissipate the heat.

You can 100% use 6/2 romex. Its rated at 65A. If they planned on running through wall, I dont see the issue?

 

[PJnc284]

You can 100% use 6/2 romex. Its rated at 65A. If they planned on running through wall, I dont see the issue?

You're supposed to use the 60C column for romex. Seems some jurisdictions do allow 6/2 romex for a 48amp EVSE though. There's a guy on youtube somewhere in I think NJ and his apparently allows it. Granted I doubt it's going to burn the house down either way. I'd be much more concerned with people using el cheapo nema 14-50's.

 

[LightningDan]

You're supposed to use the 60C column for romex. Seems some jurisdictions do allow 6/2 romex for a 48amp EVSE though. There's a guy on youtube somewhere in I think NJ and his apparently allows it. Granted I doubt it's going to burn the house down either way. I'd be much more concerned with people using el cheapo nema 14-50's.

Interesting! Yeah youre correct, if its typical NM cable its in the 60C column. All Ive ever run is THHN CU in EMT. Not worth risking it.

 

[25StarWhiteLightning]

Anyone else checked temperatures? Would be curious what others are seeing.

 

[K6CCC]

Would you mind measuring some temperatures on the breaker and the FCSP cable after about an hour of full power charging?

I'm out of town for a few more days, but I can when I get back home.

I'm back home and the truck has been charging all night (19 - 100%), but it's pouring rain right now and I'm not going outside to measure anything. I'll try to measure this on the next charge session - most likely Friday night...

 

[123XYZ]

Just got my Ford Promise charger installed (Emporia Classic hardwired for 48A). During install they told me they planned to install 6/2 romex and I told them they can't for full rating on 60A breaker so they agreed to switch to MC cable.

I am doing a charge from 70% to 100% (road trip tomorrow) and checked on it about every 15 minutes. I noticed the cable and breaker were getting warm. At about 1 hour in I took some temperature readings. The breaker was about 122F at the surface of the breaker and the cable was about 123F where it was sitting wrapped around the charger.

Two questions:

1. Is the 60a breaker getting too hot?
2. Is the cable getting too hot?

I read the Emporia manual it doesn't specifically say the cable needs to be unwound during charging, but it might make sense (although a huge nuisance) to unwind it.

Garage ambient was probably 73F.

What is everyone else seeing?

100% normal and not any sort of concern.

That breaker, the panel it's in, and the wires & MC cable connected to it all have maximum temperature ratings. All of those should be 75° C or 90° C. The lower rating controls and that's probably 75° C. You're not close to that.

 

[123XYZ]

I had same conversation with an electrician who was wiring my friends new home. They were going to use 6 AWG Romex to hard wire his 60 amp Wall Connector. He said the do it all the time. I insisted he wire it with THHN in conduit or SEU CU 6-6-8 cable. He finally agreed to wire it with THHN in conduit.

In the end he wired it with 6/3 NM-B Romex with a 60 amp breaker. We had to derate the Wall Connector to 40 amps and replace the breaker with a 50 amp breaker.

here’s a good installation video from a good electrician explains using 6 AWG SE Service Entrance cable that is good to 65 amps on a hard wired 60 amp charger. Go to 12:30 minute mark for explanation.

He agreed to do it with THHN in conduit & then did it in the exact way you'd asked him not to? And you paid him? Was the work being done without permits?

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