How Much Battery Capacity And Range Has My Ford F-150 Lightning Lost After 3 Years and 38,000 Miles?

[COrocket]

I spoke to a Ford dealer on the phone today and he said he looked my truck up and it showed 96% SOH on my hi voltage battery. I have 2023 Lariat ER. I asked him how I could see that info for myself and he said I couldn't. I'd like to know after 2 years/31,000 miles how my battery is doing.

You can get an OBDII scanner and read HV battery SOH. Seems most people just get wireless ones with bluetooth connections to their phone for casual use. I think vLinker and OBDLink are popular on amazon. I've had good success with the OBDLink MX+.

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[FloridaMan655321]

That's what the video chapters are for. Just click "conclusion", and the video is only 2 minutes long

But what if I don't want to watch 2 minutes. What is the amount?

 

[astrand1]

Thank you. I haven't used an OBDII -yet. I made a decision early on not to use one. There are a LOT of YouTubers out there using them, and I fully support that - I have nothing against using one.
But I thought a lot about it for myself, and I decided I didn't want to use one in my videos.

I try to make my videos easilly consumable for those that aren't really very EV-knowledgable. (Nothing against folks like those here that are real EV enthusiasts and want all of the geeky EV data they can get).

I don't like the optics of using one in my videos because I think it scares some of the newcomers to EVs. I remember years ago reading the comments on a Nissan LEAF video where the person was using one and quite a few people stated that they don't want to buy a car that they need to plug in a computer to understand how it's working.

Now this was the early days of EVs, and there were more naysayers then there are now - although we still have a lot of them. So I decided to try to make my video reviews more like they were being made for people who are considering an EV and want a simple, layman's explanation of how they work. I may rethink that approach, but that's why I haven't used one to date.

I see your point and can definitely appreciate it. I do think in this instance just to get the SOH of the battery and nothing else would be interesting. And I’m sure you could deliver it in such a way so as to not go over anybody’s head. These days we can check SOH of iPhone batteries in the settings so I think it might not be so off putting as it may of been in prior yrs.

 

[Maxx]

Thank you. I haven't used an OBDII -yet. I made a decision early on not to use one. There are a LOT of YouTubers out there using them, and I fully support that - I have nothing against using one.
But I thought a lot about it for myself, and I decided I didn't want to use one in my videos.

I try to make my videos easilly consumable for those that aren't really very EV-knowledgable. (Nothing against folks like those here that are real EV enthusiasts and want all of the geeky EV data they can get).

I don't like the optics of using one in my videos because I think it scares some of the newcomers to EVs. I remember years ago reading the comments on a Nissan LEAF video where the person was using one and quite a few people stated that they don't want to buy a car that they need to plug in a computer to understand how it's working.

Now this was the early days of EVs, and there were more naysayers then there are now - although we still have a lot of them. So I decided to try to make my video reviews more like they were being made for people who are considering an EV and want a simple, layman's explanation of how they work. I may rethink that approach, but that's why I haven't used one to date.

I use OBDII and it has helped me understand a bunch of things but still confusing on others. For example SOH of 98% makes sense when you divide 95.88 KWh by what the capacity was when new (98KWh usable)

But on the other hand you would think 99% of 95.88 KWh would be 94.92 KWh not 91.83 KWh

The gap widens as you go down and shrinks again as you go lower. It looks like Energy is the usable energy and displayed SOC should correspond to that.

In short, I don't blame you for staying out of it but I would watch any youtube posting on it if you didn't.

 

[PJnc284]

SOH can vary by several percent from one minute to the next so I dont pay much attention to it. It is pretty handy though since you can customize the pages and even record/export data.

General driving screen (just running in demo mode)

Charging screen. Can see what the truck is requesting v what it's receiving. This was when i got derated on a supercharger. (Had the wrong value for voltage which is why it shows 0 but has since been adjusted)

Updated charging screen in demo mode

Driving screen with more details.

 

[MountainAlive]

From what I understand in layman’s terms is that it’s mostly time and not miles that degrade the EV battery. ICE folks are always concerned about how many miles are on the engine. But with EVs, especially the Lightning, you could drive it 500,000 miles in 5 years and it’s fine. However, if the truck is 15 years old with only 50,000 miles on it, that’s potentially a different story with battery degradation.

 

[chl]

From what I understand in layman’s terms is that it’s mostly time and not miles that degrade the EV battery. ICE folks are always concerned about how many miles are on the engine. But with EVs, especially the Lightning, you could drive it 500,000 miles in 5 years and it’s fine. However, if the truck is 15 years old with only 50,000 miles on it, that’s potentially a different story with battery degradation.

There are multiple effects that contribute to battery degradation.
Age is one - the estimates are 1% to 2% loss of capacity per year, last time I checked.

Another one is how often one does DC fast charging, and heat stress in general.

Another one that may have been overlooked in the early days of EVs is the depth of charge/discharge - discharging/recharging by more than 50% seems to be a significant factor.

The depth of discharge factor is why bench testing EV batteries, with repeated full to near empty cycles, produces a life span estimate lower than real world EV use - most EV users don't drive their EVs to near empty then refill to near full, we tend to charge to 80% and discharge to 40% or 50% before recharging, so a 30% to 40% depth.

My lightly used 2012 Nissan Leaf (only used for short local trips since purchase in Dec 2011) reports about an 85% SOH with the original 24kWh battery, and the way I drive it (getting an average of 4.8mi.kWh) means it is still useful.

My original range in the Leaf was close to 120 miles max under certain conditions: not using the AC or cabin heat (just using heated seat and steering wheel in winter), not going over 45 mph, slow acceleration and deceleration, driving in ECO mode, generally level neighborhood roads, coasting with regenerative braking down hills, etc.

The battery degradation is a lot less than the naysayers propose.

My brother in law once said to me he wouldn't buy an EV because replacing the battery costs a ton of money (OMG lol).

Well, the battery is the most expensive part of the EV, but they are generally warranted for 8 to 10 years and 100k miles, so you're probably never going to replace the battery. But if you ever do, the cost of batteries is steadily declining, and the technology is improving, and putting in a new battery is like having a brand new EV, the motors will probably last decades. And the maintenance on an EV is practically zero, no tune up, oil changes, filters, or gasoline to purchase. And no tail pipe emissions to contribute to global climate change and air pollution, or petroleum leaks to pollute the ground and water, so you'd be leaving a better world for your grand-children to live in, eh?

That shut him up.

 

[beschneider]

@tommolog Another excellent video. Wondered if you have looked at the data via the OBDII port and CarScanner etc to see what the truck reports as its SoH? My 2022 just turned three years old this past month and mine still reports 100% SoH via the OBDII data. I suspect that's the result of slowly releasing some buffer capacity as well, but also question that as it's data Ford doesn't make really available to users so there's really no need to fudge it. The other thing (and maybe your charge tests show this) is that the available capacity was always a bit more than 131 kWh but the truck uses 131 for the calculation anyway. Either way, I'm just as happy as you are that mine still shows full capacity and no degradation after three years.

What app did you use with the OBDII data. Preferrably a free version. Thx

 

[jthiesse13]

You can get an OBDII scanner and read HV battery SOH. Seems most people just get wireless ones with bluetooth connections to their phone for casual use. I think vLinker and OBDLink are popular on amazon. I've had good success with the OBDLink MX+.

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I bought the OBDLinkMX+ and connected it to my 2023 Lightning Lariat ER. I don't see any options in the app to read the HV battery SOH.

 

[PJnc284]

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I bought the OBDLinkMX+ and connected it to my 2023 Lightning Lariat ER. I don't see any options in the app to read the HV battery SOH.

What app are you using? I've been happy with CarScanner

 

[detansinn]

The thermal stresses of DC fast charging is way overplayed. Studies have shown DC fast charging isn't nearly as detrimental to battery life as people once thought. Modern EVs like our Lightnings are quite good at managing temperatures across the modules. It's not like a phone or laptop where the cooling is passive.

I'm coming up to 50k miles in 2 1/2 years of ownership. You only rack up those kind of miles with a lot of DC fast charging. My own experiences with the truck are right in line with @tommolog 's excellent video.

I bought the truck with the intention of getting a decade or more out of it, but we're off to a great start.

 

[swajames]

What app did you use with the OBDII data. Preferrably a free version. Thx

I use CarScanner. It has both free and paid options. Mine is paid, but the free version should get you the data you want to see.

 

[Lomilar]

In CarScanner you can check the BMS state of charge and compare it to the reported state of charge. It's on the first screen. I expect if you went to 100% and checked BMS SOC, then to 0% and checked BMS SOC, that'd tell you (comparing to other people with other trucks) for sure whether you're eating the buffer.

That's what occurred to me after watching Tom's video. Definitely in a 'usable' sense there's no degredation, but inquiring minds.....

 

[chl]

The thermal stresses of DC fast charging is way overplayed. Studies have shown DC fast charging isn't nearly as detrimental to battery life as people once thought. Modern EVs like our Lightnings are quite good at managing temperatures across the modules. It's not like a phone or laptop where the cooling is passive.

I'm coming up to 50k miles in 2 1/2 years of ownership. You only rack up those kind of miles with a lot of DC fast charging. My own experiences with the truck are right in line with @tommolog 's excellent video.

I bought the truck with the intention of getting a decade or more out of it, but we're off to a great start.

Link to studies you referred to?
What is your SOH and how much DC fast charging have you done?

 

[Firn]

Thank you. I haven't used an OBDII -yet. I made a decision early on not to use one. There are a LOT of YouTubers out there using them, and I fully support that - I have nothing against using one.
But I thought a lot about it for myself, and I decided I didn't want to use one in my videos.

I try to make my videos easilly consumable for those that aren't really very EV-knowledgable. (Nothing against folks like those here that are real EV enthusiasts and want all of the geeky EV data they can get).

I don't like the optics of using one in my videos because I think it scares some of the newcomers to EVs. I remember years ago reading the comments on a Nissan LEAF video where the person was using one and quite a few people stated that they don't want to buy a car that they need to plug in a computer to understand how it's working.

Now this was the early days of EVs, and there were more naysayers then there are now - although we still have a lot of them. So I decided to try to make my video reviews more like they were being made for people who are considering an EV and want a simple, layman's explanation of how they work. I may rethink that approach, but that's why I haven't used one to date.

As you can see quite a few dig into the OBD side of things but I recognize and appreciate you keeping your content approachable.

However, this might be a good example of how the data could be helpful. If Ford is digging into the "buffer" so to speak we should see overall pack (and module) voltage shift up slightly over time, and or the bottom voltage drift down over time. That is how they would "use" the buffer if they are doing so.

Edit:
Running some numbers, and assuming a top buffer only, we should see ROUGHLY a 1v increase to pack voltage for every 1% of degredation. Or a cell voltage increase of about 0.01v for every 1% degredation. Plus, assuming there is a top buffer only that Ford eats into that would indicate there is only about 6-10% buffer depending on if Ford allows the cells to go to 4.2v, 4.15v is more realistic which is a 6% buffer.

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