How to Get Consumer Reports to fix their testing

[Maineiac12]

The EPA is a mixed driving estimate. However, can can use the gov website to adjust the mix (in this case 100% highway). Again, the point is if you are going to change the test criteria (driving type), you need to use the correct rating to compare against.

The issue is how EPA presents the numbers on the vehicle itself. The only range number they list on the window sticker is the combined number of 320. Nobody cares about MPGe, they care about range. They need to list a city, highway, and combination value for range just like ICE to avoid confusion.

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[flyct]

The CR report on actual rage seems to be accurate for the speeds they measured. My friend has a Lyriq and it gets more range than published. My Lightning and my Tesla Model Ys don't reach EPA range as highway speeds. I went from a Nissan Leaf with less than 80 miles of range so I'm OK with the range I receive, but someone who is less knowledgeable and purchases an EV can be REALLY disappointed.

It would be nice if manufactures published real range at different highway speeds.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[RocketGhost]

I think the article was fair. The point they were making was that the EPA estimate in big numbers on the window sticker can be very inaccurate for highway driving in either direction due to outdated testing methodology and the way it's presented as one combined number. I read the article as being critical of the EPA and not the cars themselves.

The issue with EVs is that their range varies far more than ICE vehicles due to how it's driven and the conditions it's driven in. What would be best is if the highway range is presented with high, low, and average estimates; city range in high, low, and average estimates; and combined high, low, and average estimates. MPGe needs to go away and mi/kwh efficiencies need to be shown along with range for each. That's a lot of information, so not all of it needs to be on the window sticker, but the data being out there would help consumers realize the realities of EV range.

 

[Pacific.NW]

I hope to never discover the true full 100% range of my battery because in most cases I'm not getting down below 10-15%! lol

 

[chl]

I think that it is fair to report the actual range, because people make decisions based upon it. We can debate on how realistic their test is, but you can’t debate that the Lightning does not usually get the EPA range. In good conditions, I easily beat the EPA on my e-Golf and my Kia EV6 but it is hard to get 200 out of my EPA-rated 230 SR Lightning. That is important information.

This was also true of my ICE F-150, which was the only vehicle that I have owned that underperformed the EPA. (The EPA testing protocols can be gamed by the auto manufacturers and some try harder than others.)

True, and true.

No ICE vehicle I have ever had got the EPA MPG rating in "real world" driving, i.e., 10 to 15 mph over the 60 mph for highway driving that the EPA uses.

According to CR:

"...the EPA test for city fuel economy is conducted at very low speeds, with gentle acceleration and minimal idling. The highway test includes quite a bit of stop-and-go driving, with a maximum speed of 60 mph and an average speed of 48. Hybrids are most efficient in those conditions...."

I generally do BETTER than the EPA rating with my EVs (2012 Leaf and 2023 Lightning) because I drive differently in an EV, slow acceleration, gradual deceleration with regenerative braking, coast down hills, no AC or heat (except in extreme circumstances) etc.

Our 2015 Prius definitely gets or beats the EPA rating.

The number 55 mph which used to be the national highway max speed, was derived from testing and experiments that indicated that most ICE vehicles run more efficiently (at 1/3 to 2/3 max rpm). Also, vehicles are aerodynamically more efficient at lower speeds. Over 55 mph engine inefficiency and drag combine to steepen the energy use curve.

EVs are completely different when it comes to engine efficiency, but also are adversely affected by drag. Optimum speed for most vehicles to get the best efficiency before drag becomes a big factor seems to be around 35 to 40 mph.

EV engine efficiency, really battery efficiency, is more a factor of temperature than RPM. Electric motors have a wider range of efficient speeds than ICE engines, the sweet spot, although there is an optimum range of RPMs for electric motors. Some EVs use a transmission (e.g., the Porsche Taycan) to stay within the optimum RPM range.

We EV drivers are in general more aware of the fine points than the average consumer which is what CR seems to aim for as their audience. The general consumer does not see the nuances we do.

This has been an issue with CR since forever. Audiophiles harshly criticized CR's review of stereo equipment and related components since their inception.

I remember my brother (an avid CR reader, alas) told me that in their review of the Nissan Leaf the reviewer complained of the noise it made at slow speeds - the government mandated noise intended to warn pedestrians of its approach since it is so quiet otherwise they might not know it was there!

"...National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) in the US, have implemented regulations requiring EVs to emit sounds when traveling below a certain speed (e.g., 18.6 mph or 30 km/h)..."

https://abrhouston.com/electric-vehicle-weird-noises/

He was driving a tin-can Toyota Rav4 at the time - go figure.

I learned to mostly ignore CR way back in the 1970s - I will continue to ignore their sensational headlines to get click revenue re. EVs.

 

[chl]

The issue with EVs is that their range varies far more than ICE vehicles due to how it's driven and the conditions it's driven in.

Or are we just made more aware of it all the time on the dash with range guesstimates that fluctuate all the time?

If ICE vehicles had a comparable system then when an ICE is going 80 mph it would tell the driver your range dropped 15.4% vs what it was when you were going 70 mph.

"...Studies show that fuel economy can decrease by 12.4% from 50 to 60 mph, 14% from 60 to 70 mph, and 15.4% from 70 to 80 mph, according to the Department of Energy... Driving at 80 mph can lead to an increase in fuel consumption of up to 40-55% compared to driving at 55 mph, according to Quora ..."

There is an interesting analysis on Quora at:

https://www.quora.com/How-much-more-fuel-is-consumed-per-hour-at-55-vs-80-mph

"... driving an EV at 30mph can give you economy of 150 Wh/mile or 224 mpg-e (equivalent to mpg based on kWh in a quantity of fossil fuel) but get up to 55mph and now you are 225 Wh/mile (149mpg-e) but at 80mph you are at 350Wh/mile (112mpg-e). So a massive difference but note the units mpg-e even at 80mph is still 112 compared to a typical fossil fuel car at 30–45mpg."

That's the kind of analysis CR is incapable of, and so the average consumer who barely understood algebra 1 (probably - no disrespect, I can barely speel - everyones got their pros and cons).

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