Pro Power problem

[Maquis]

You were right. Power company just took care of it. Neutral at transformer was completely disconnected. A falling branch during storm took it out. Everything is stable now. My amplifier did have a heart attack and is buzzing now. I am not sure loss of neutral caused it or a lightning.

On the Pro power, got one more question: I have some extension cords that have only two wires. what happens if I use those for some appliances using one of those 2 to 3 hole adapters at the end (if they are not connected to Truck’s ground)?

Glad you got it fixed. 10 to 1 it was the open neutral that fried your amp.

Using a 2 wire cord with an adapter connected to ProPower is safer than doing the same with house power because the truck has GFCI protection. I still wouldn’t do it. Most 2 wire cords are small gauge wire and it’s too easy to just go buy a 3 wire cord.

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[Maxx]

Glad you got it fixed. 10 to 1 it was the open neutral that fried your amp.

Using a 2 wire cord with an adapter connected to ProPower is safer than doing the same with house power because the truck has GFCI protection. I still wouldn’t do it. Most 2 wire cords are small gauge wire and it’s too easy to just go buy a 3 wire cord.

U Da Man. Appreciate the great insight and advice.

 

[Hammick]

OP here. Took my Lightning to a different dealer to have it diagnosed with an oscilloscope. When I called they said that was the only way to properly diagnose it. So I checked in and explained the problem thoroughly to the advisor. 90 minutes later they find me in the customer's lounge and I walk out with the advisor to see the EV tech. He told me nothing is wrong with my truck as it's not throwing any faults. I asked him what the oscilloscope showed and I got the Scooby Doo. I Politely asked him if he was familiar with the correct North American HZ of electricity and he assured me he was. I got out my meter and showed him the frunk outlets at a steady 59+ HZ and the bed outlets all over the place. More Scooby Doo (I'll never get that 3 hours of my life back)

So I left and drove to my selling dealer who has been crickets for the last 10 days. Drove in and my Advisor was already gone. However the service manager was there and he told me they have been in contact with Ford and they have been instructed to dismantle the plugs and see if there is a problem. I told him that was news to me as I hadn't heard anything. He seemed surprised I was in the dark. I said maybe email is not the best way to communicate.

Anyway truck is going in Thursday morning for diagnosis of the outlets. I'm guessing there are no electronics in the plugs and it needs a new inverter. This may be a slow process but I will never give up.

 

[Maquis]

OP here. Took my Lightning to a different dealer to have it diagnosed with an oscilloscope. When I called they said that was the only way to properly diagnose it. So I checked in and explained the problem thoroughly to the advisor. 90 minutes later they find me in the customer's lounge and I walk out with the advisor to see the EV tech. He told me nothing is wrong with my truck as it's not throwing any faults. I asked him what the oscilloscope showed and I got the Scooby Doo. I Politely asked him if he was familiar with the correct North American HZ of electricity and he assured me he was. I got out my meter and showed him the frunk outlets at a steady 59+ HZ and the bed outlets all over the place. More Scooby Doo (I'll never get that 3 hours of my life back)

So I left and drove to my selling dealer who has been crickets for the last 10 days. Drove in and my Advisor was already gone. However the service manager was there and he told me they have been in contact with Ford and they have been instructed to dismantle the plugs and see if there is a problem. I told him that was news to me as I hadn't heard anything. He seemed surprised I was in the dark. I said maybe email is not the best way to communicate.

Anyway truck is going in Thursday morning for diagnosis of the outlets. I'm guessing there are no electronics in the plugs and it needs a new inverter. This may be a slow process but I will never give up.

It’s really frustrating that dealer service departments aren’t trained well enough to troubleshoot something like this. It’s 90% common sense. Your technical aptitude is commendable. Imagine the average person having to deal with this! Stay persistent!

 

[Yellow Buddy]

OP here. Took my Lightning to a different dealer to have it diagnosed with an oscilloscope. When I called they said that was the only way to properly diagnose it. So I checked in and explained the problem thoroughly to the advisor. 90 minutes later they find me in the customer's lounge and I walk out with the advisor to see the EV tech. He told me nothing is wrong with my truck as it's not throwing any faults. I asked him what the oscilloscope showed and I got the Scooby Doo. I Politely asked him if he was familiar with the correct North American HZ of electricity and he assured me he was. I got out my meter and showed him the frunk outlets at a steady 59+ HZ and the bed outlets all over the place. More Scooby Doo (I'll never get that 3 hours of my life back)

So I left and drove to my selling dealer who has been crickets for the last 10 days. Drove in and my Advisor was already gone. However the service manager was there and he told me they have been in contact with Ford and they have been instructed to dismantle the plugs and see if there is a problem. I told him that was news to me as I hadn't heard anything. He seemed surprised I was in the dark. I said maybe email is not the best way to communicate.

Anyway truck is going in Thursday morning for diagnosis of the outlets. I'm guessing there are no electronics in the plugs and it needs a new inverter. This may be a slow process but I will never give up.

Data point here, got this today:

Nothing was plugged into the bed or frunk outlets when the message showed, haven’t had something plugged in for about a month now…I did however update recently - within the last week.

 

[Hammick]

OP here. My selling dealer did a bunch of test on my Lightning today at Ford's direction. The oscilloscope showed clean power. Ford told the service manager that they've had issues with some trucks and replacing the inverter didn't fix it. He said they have escalated it to high priority.

Now I have a theory and I was hoping someone with a meter that reads HZ can help me. I'm wondering if the Pro Power uses a "high frequency inverter" a/k/a "transformerless inverter" to save weight. If someone can test the HZ output of their bed Pro Power I will be forever grateful.

The frunk outlets hold a steady 59+ HZ when running a heat gun. However, running my 56v Ego battery charger and the HZ are all over the place just like the bed outlets.

I plugged our fancy oven that won't run off the bed outlets into the Panamax 4300 power conditioner I use for my good stereo equipment. Oven powered right up. So I'm hopeful my Pro Power doesn't have a problem and I just need a line conditioner for the circuit the oven is on.

 

[v2h8484]

The inverter is most likely high frequency as a low frequency one would require a big and heavy transformer at 7kW. However, there is no inherent reason to prevent a high frequency inverter from producing high quality power. It just needs appropriate filtering components. It's possible that defective filtering components could be the problem cause rather an a deficient inverter design.

 

[Hammick]

The inverter is most likely high frequency as a low frequency one would require a big and heavy transformer at 7kW. However, there is no inherent reason to prevent a high frequency inverter from producing high quality power. It just needs appropriate filtering components. It's possible that defective filtering components could be the problem cause rather an a deficient inverter design.

So I have more research but is it normal for a high frequency inverter to output as high as 3,000hz? Or should I be expecting 60hz?

 

[v2h8484]

So I have more research but is it normal for a high frequency inverter to output as high as 3,000hz? Or should I be expecting 60hz?

The noise can easily be 3kHZ or higher. Imagine relatively small 3KHz waveforms riding on top of large 60Hz waveforms. Multimeters can easily get confused when there is such noise. If you are familiar with audio amplifiers, you may know about Class D amplifiers that are quite similar to high frequency power inverters in terms of using high frequency switching to produce sine wave output at a particular frequency. Both need good filtering components to remove the high switching frequency and associated harmonics in order produce high quality output at the target frequency (60Hz for inverters).

 

[Hammick]

The noise can easily be 3kHZ or higher. Imagine relatively small 3KHz waveforms riding on top of large 60Hz waveforms. Multimeters can easily get confused when there is such noise. If you are familiar with audio amplifiers, you may know about Class D amplifiers that are quite similar to high frequency power inverters in terms of using high frequency switching to produce sine wave output at a particular frequency. Both need good filtering components to remove the high switching frequency and associated harmonics in order produce high quality output at the target frequency (60Hz for inverters).

Thank you! You convinced me that maybe my Klein meter wasn't reading the HZ correctly. Realized I have another power conditioner with a display that reads HZ. Ran a 12ga extension cord from the bed outlet to the APC and sure enough it's showing 60hz. The oven will run off that power conditioner as well. It will also run off my basic Belkin surge protector with line filtering built in. Problem solved and I don't have to spend $$$ on another line conditioner. I still find it weird that the frunk powers the oven no problem. You would think they would be equal quality in terms of output noise.

I learned a good lesson here and I appreciate everyone's help. Still can't justify shelling out $500 for a Fluke meter.

 

[v2h8484]

I still find it weird that the frunk powers the oven no problem. You would think they would be equal quality in terms of output noise.

This is one reason why I think the problem could be due to bad filtering components in the truck bed inverter rather than a poor design overall. It's possible your inverter came from a production run with a bad batch of components.

 

[Hammick]

This is one reason why I think the problem could be due to bad filtering components in the truck bed inverter rather than a poor design overall. It's possible your inverter came from a production run with a bad batch of components.

Makes sense especially since it works with a power conditioner inline.

 

[Hammick]

Well I finally had a chance to try our oven on a new '23 Lariat ER at my dealer. Oven wouldn't power on using the bed outlets but would power with the frunk outlets. So my rear inverter is working properly I guess. I have no explanation as to why the front inverter works other than its cleaner power than the rear. Looks like my big power conditioner has found a permanent home.

Franky I'm kinda relieved the '23 wouldn't power the oven. I wasn't looking forward to battling Ford for a new inverter.

 

[TaxmanHog]

Well I finally had a chance to try our oven on a new '23 Lariat ER. Oven wouldn't power on using the bed outlets but would power with the frunk outlets. So my rear inverter is working properly I guess. I have no explanation as to why the front inverter works other than its cleaner power than the rear. Looks like my big power conditioner has found a permanent home.

Franky I kinda relieved the '23 wouldn't power the oven. I wasn't looking forward to battling Ford for a new inverter.

Is the '23 an additional Lightning or replacement of the '22

 

[Hammick]

Is the '23 an additional Lightning or replacement of the '22

Sorry I should have stated the '23 is on my dealer's lot. They have about 5 lightnings in inventory and a ton of Mach-Es lined up.

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