i need serious help on this decision

[RickLightning]

Don't plan on EV charger infrastructure to do anything positive for at least the next 4 years.

Spoken by someone who has no perspective on the EV charging infrastructure or how it's changed since 2021, nor the pipeline of new chargers.

We've driven through 26 states and 1 province. 2021 was awful. 2022 got better, 2023 was at times worse. In 2024, with the inclusion of Tesla, plus networks like Pilot / Flying J coming online, in much of the country it's noticeably better. No, not everywhere. No, not all the time. But noticeably better.

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[StevenC56]

Spoken by someone who has no perspective on the EV charging infrastructure or how it's changed since 2021, nor the pipeline of new chargers.

We've driven through 26 states and 1 province. 2021 was awful. 2022 got better, 2023 was at times worse. In 2024, with the inclusion of Tesla, plus networks like Pilot / Flying J coming online, in much of the country it's noticeably better. No, not everywhere. No, not all the time. But noticeably better.

I never said things hadn't gotten better in the last 4 years. They most certainly have. But my point was the next 4 years are not looking so good for EV's.

 

[Lytning]

To each his own. But I must admit that I am puzzled by someone asking others for input on how to spend their money. I personally would never think of doing so. Nobody else knows my personal financial situation.

I purchased my Lightning when I was 71 years old. I literally worked my entire life to be able to purchase it as a retirement gift to myself. I spent most of my life doing without "wants" to ensure I met the "needs" of my family, and to save and invest for retirement. After providing food, shelter, clothing, education and basic transportation for my family, I put money into an emergency fund, insurance, and invested all I could in a retirement account.

I would not dare to attempt to tell you how to spend your money. But I would suggest that you ensure you have all of your needs covered before spending money on wants. It may seem a long way off, but I speak from experience when I say retirement will be upon you before you know it.

 

[RickLightning]

I never said things hadn't gotten better in the last 4 years. They most certainly have. But my point was the next 4 years are not looking so good for EV's.

I expect every year to be better than the prior year. Nothing tells me that won't happen.

 

[broncoaz]

Do like the fed and borrow your way out of debt or print more money. Works for them, should work for you. ???

Seriously do what you can afford and works for your needs. None of us can validate the decision for you.

As other people have said you will loose tons and tons to depreciation for the new Lightning. Many of us have lost around $20k or more that first year. Ford Credit sadly reminds me of this every time I login with there ever so insulting “trade in value” listed on the dashboard. Today’s insult is that my $73,500 XLT has lost $33,000 in value in just shy of 18 months. So with the tax credit, $25k in 18 months.

So if you can stomach that type of hit again, or get an amazing deal and can afford it, go for it!

These numbers are why I leased my Flash, my three year lease will cost me less than your 18 month depreciation. I don’t typically put more than 10-12K miles on my vehicles, so leasing works in my situation.

 

[StevenC56]

I expect every year to be better than the prior year. Nothing tells me that won't happen.

I really hope you are correct. We'll see, but I don't share your optimism.

 

[RickLightning]

I really hope you are correct. We'll see, but I don't share your optimism.

I have fast charged, per PlugShare, 236 times. There are probably 1/2 dozen I forgot to check in. Some of those are repeats, but the majority are not. In my experience, at an EA location in 2021 - 2023, with 4 chargers, you were likely to find at least one broken. You had a 33% chance the chargers were derated. And, you had a 40% chance that there was a wait.

I have now charged at maybe 20 Tesla SuperCharger locations. The longest wait was under 10 minutes, and that was because they were using every other spot so I had to wait for one to open since we take 2 spots (or the end). The 2nd longest wait was 2 minutes, and that was it. I have had ONE experience where the charger was slower than I expected. I have many times where less than 25% of them are occupied.

Pilot / Flying J, while more expensive, has filled some gaps. I used to have to drive 200 miles to the first fast charger heading south (doable on the way out, not fun on the way back). Now there are 2 or 3 Pilot / Flying J chargers on that stretch of road.

So yes, it is getting better. There is a huge amount, over 90%, of the IRA funds that are allocated, but not yet installed. They have to order transformers, they have to route lines, and they have to get permits. 2025 is going to see a massive increase, blown away by the increase in 2026.

Best part - Tesla, with membership, is cheaper that all other options in my experience.

 

[StevenC56]

I have fast charged, per PlugShare, 236 times. There are probably 1/2 dozen I forgot to check in. Some of those are repeats, but the majority are not. In my experience, at an EA location in 2021 - 2023, with 4 chargers, you were likely to find at least one broken. You had a 33% chance the chargers were derated. And, you had a 40% chance that there was a wait.

I have now charged at maybe 20 Tesla SuperCharger locations. The longest wait was under 10 minutes, and that was because they were using every other spot so I had to wait for one to open since we take 2 spots (or the end). The 2nd longest wait was 2 minutes, and that was it. I have had ONE experience where the charger was slower than I expected. I have many times where less than 25% of them are occupied.

Pilot / Flying J, while more expensive, has filled some gaps. I used to have to drive 200 miles to the first fast charger heading south (doable on the way out, not fun on the way back). Now there are 2 or 3 Pilot / Flying J chargers on that stretch of road.

So yes, it is getting better. There is a huge amount, over 90%, of the IRA funds that are allocated, but not yet installed. They have to order transformers, they have to route lines, and they have to get permits. 2025 is going to see a massive increase, blown away by the increase in 2026.

Best part - Tesla, with membership, is cheaper that all other options in my experience.

Every situation you have encountered up until now is what I have seen as well. From today on however, we'll see. Do you really think that current infrastructure monies are going to be left alone and used as intended?

 

[RickLightning]

Every situation you have encountered up until now is what I have seen as well. From today on however, we'll see. Do you really think that current infrastructure monies are going to be left alone and used as intended?

Yes, because the states have the funds. Any attempt to claw them back will be met with legal challenges.

 

[1Jetpilot]

Do what is practical and what you want. I traded my Tesla for my Lightning after 9 months and took the negative equity but didn’t think about the math just what made sense to what I wanted at the time and what would make me happy. I never flinched until I had to trade in the Lightning to flat tow behind my RV…..It was a very sad day indeed but was lucky to find a dealer that gave me a good trade value in bad market for used EVs. Yes I sucked it up twice but love my new gas guzzling, burn baby burn, and drill baby drill ICE truck. Moral of the story is you never know what is behind the next corner of your life so don’t cut yourself short…..you may die tomorrow then what have you not done? Be good to yourself….money is just paper your happiness is more important than money.

 

[StevenC56]

I'll never go back to an ICE vehicle again unless the drill baby drill administration makes me do so, and I suppose that's a possibility.

 

[earlyadopt]

I currently have a 2023 Mustang Mach-E GT that I've had for about a year. I really like it, and I got it at 0% APR. I still owe around $45k on it, and the best offer I’ve gotten for it is $35k, so there’s some negative equity. I’m thinking of upgrading to a Ford Lightning 2024, and here’s the breakdown:

• The Lightning will cost me $71k OTD, factoring in the negative equity from my Mach-E (it’s about $10k rolled over).
• My monthly payment will go up by around $150/month, but my insurance drops by $100/month, so the net increase is about $50/month.

I test drove the Lightning and loved it – the space, the driving experience, everything. But here’s the catch:

1. Negative Equity: I’m worried about the $10k I’m rolling over from my Mach-E. If I don’t love the Lightning in a few years, I might be stuck with it or take a loss when I trade it in.
2. Battery Range: I’ve heard the Lightning’s bigger battery can burn through range quicker, especially compared to my Mach-E. Does anyone with a Lightning feel like it’s a “gas-guzzler” in terms of range, even though it’s electric? I know the battery is bigger, but I’m wondering if it drains faster, especially with some speed and power driving.

I like the idea of the truck, especially for the extra space with my growing family, but I don’t want to make a decision I’ll regret.

What do you all think? Should I make the jump now, or wait until I’m in a better equity position with my current car? i have 3 sons who fit n mach e now but in due time growing i think ill get more use from the truck. family wise and side hustle wise. and ill personally enjoy the new found room for my back and comfortability compared to mach e. 71k for flash with trade dont seem to horrible to me

I owe both the MachE premium 2023 and the Lightning XLT 2024 so I have a definitive opinion on both. To start, they are both amazing driving vehicles. I understand your position since I wanted the ability to have a vehicle with utility capability (Lightning) and a vehicle that was easy to drive at a mall and just general driving from A to B.
Efficientcy:
My MachE gets 5Km/Kwh or 3.1 miles/Kwh of power not bad, the Lightning gets 4Km/Kwh or 2.5 miles/kw so 20% less but for a truck, this is really cheap to run. So far in the winter, the lightning is getting about 2 miles/Kwh, it has the heat pump which is a blessing. The machE has dropped down to 2.5 miles/Kwh since it does not have the heat pump. Frankly not much of a big deal.

Room- Lightning has the MachE beat every which way if you want large

Convenience:
Driving to the mall is a royal pain in the ass since the lightning comes about like the Queen Mary. Be prepared to get some extra steps, since parking is a bit more work. In bad traffic, this can be nerve racking. It's a truck.
The MachE beats it in Mall parking, small space requirements etc. Traffic is easier in the MachE since changing lanes and driving like a New Yorker is easier with the MachE. If no one knows what I am saying about New Yorker, well they tend to drive with the idea "do onto others before they do onto you" (aggressive navigation)

The drive with the Lightning is amazing, I had a F150 Lariat before this and the drive was nothing like the lightning. Fast is an understatment. The truck is faster than most super cars. Even faster than my MachE.
As I said, I have both, love them for the strengths that each offers. The Truck was the long play since they will last beyond most regular cars. I can tell you that if you enjoy the MachE, you will miss it from time to time. If you are a truck person and really enjoy being high up and able to take yard waste, pick up building materials for the DYI projects, the Lightning is your baby.
Just know that range could be better now since the Silverado can drive longer with there larger battery pack. I decide that less than 2% of the time I would road trip, so I made a 98% decision and went with the standard range battery, never run out and always charge at home.
My next trip is to Alabama for golf, 1700 km's. I may feel different at my 10 stops on the way down.

Hope this helped a bit.

 

[nolavet504]

Correct. Why?

1) Truck is 40% less efficient. Battery is 131/91 = 44% bigger. Therefore, no difference in range.

2) Charging curves are NOT the same. Truck charges faster, holds higher speeds longer. BUT...

3) On a trip, you often seek out hotels with level 2 chargers. Most hotel chargers are in the 4 - 7kW range. Let's assume you pull in to a 7kW charger at 8PM, and leave at 8AM. Battery is 20%, you want 100% in the morning.

Mach-E: 91 x 80% charge = 73kWh / 7 = 10.4 hours. Fully charge by morning
Lightning: 131 x 80% charge = 105kWh / 7 = 15 hours. Charged to 84% by morning. Driving from 100% vs. 80% is roughly 45 minutes of driving. Therefore, to get 100% by morning you need to plan on charging at a fast charger to 36% (in this example), so that you're at 100% by morning. But if the hotel is only 4%, you're even more SOL.

Thanks. So real

I owe both the MachE premium 2023 and the Lightning XLT 2024 so I have a definitive opinion on both. To start, they are both amazing driving vehicles. I understand your position since I wanted the ability to have a vehicle with utility capability (Lightning) and a vehicle that was easy to drive at a mall and just general driving from A to B.
Efficientcy:
My MachE gets 5Km/Kwh or 3.1 miles/Kwh of power not bad, the Lightning gets 4Km/Kwh or 2.5 miles/kw so 20% less but for a truck, this is really cheap to run. So far in the winter, the lightning is getting about 2 miles/Kwh, it has the heat pump which is a blessing. The machE has dropped down to 2.5 miles/Kwh since it does not have the heat pump. Frankly not much of a big deal.

Room- Lightning has the MachE beat every which way if you want large

Convenience:
Driving to the mall is a royal pain in the ass since the lightning comes about like the Queen Mary. Be prepared to get some extra steps, since parking is a bit more work. In bad traffic, this can be nerve racking. It's a truck.
The MachE beats it in Mall parking, small space requirements etc. Traffic is easier in the MachE since changing lanes and driving like a New Yorker is easier with the MachE. If no one knows what I am saying about New Yorker, well they tend to drive with the idea "do onto others before they do onto you" (aggressive navigation)

The drive with the Lightning is amazing, I had a F150 Lariat before this and the drive was nothing like the lightning. Fast is an understatment. The truck is faster than most super cars. Even faster than my MachE.
As I said, I have both, love them for the strengths that each offers. The Truck was the long play since they will last beyond most regular cars. I can tell you that if you enjoy the MachE, you will miss it from time to time. If you are a truck person and really enjoy being high up and able to take yard waste, pick up building materials for the DYI projects, the Lightning is your baby.
Just know that range could be better now since the Silverado can drive longer with there larger battery pack. I decide that less than 2% of the time I would road trip, so I made a 98% decision and went with the standard range battery, never run out and always charge at home.
My next trip is to Alabama for golf, 1700 km's. I may feel different at my 10 stops on the way down.

Hope this helped a bit.

it did thank alot i really feel the same way the mach e gt is fast the fake noise i love and its a powerhouse. the car will pass anything on the highway that aint already full throttle. but the truck will be more room in the driver seat and it have the seat tilt function i like the mach e seat dont. so it is a big difference. i feel the range is equal even though its more juice. so my stopping should be the same. idk im still up in the air because of the negative ill have but i feel regardless what fod drop the lightning still is a decent truck. my biggest hate is the charge speed but from what im reading it maintains higher rates longer than the mach e

 

[earlyadopt]

Thanks. So real

it did thank alot i really feel the same way the mach e gt is fast the fake noise i love and its a powerhouse. the car will pass anything on the highway that aint already full throttle. but the truck will be more room in the driver seat and it have the seat tilt function i like the mach e seat dont. so it is a big difference. i feel the range is equal even though its more juice. so my stopping should be the same. idk im still up in the air because of the negative ill have but i feel regardless what fod drop the lightning still is a decent truck. my biggest hate is the charge speed but from what im reading it maintains higher rates longer than the mach e

Yes it is faster than the machE and holds for a longer time line. Speed of charging tends to only be relevant if you charge at Super Chargers. At home is a non event unless you drive a lot.

 

[gbuydos]

EVs are a choice, but look at what's coming down the pipe. Would you invest with this as a future??

The Executive Orders. Writing on the wall.

Elimination of EV Mandates: Section 2(e) of the EO states a clear intent to eliminate the “electric vehicle mandate,” promoting true consumer choice and removing what it calls “unfair subsidies” for EVs.

Freeze on Infrastructure Funding: Section 7(a) orders a pause on the disbursement of funds for electric vehicle charging stations, including programs under the National Electric Vehicle Infrastructure (NEVI) Formula Program and Charging and Fueling Infrastructure Discretionary Grant Program.

And for the projects already funded, I sure a few of those won t build.

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