80amp charger questions

[chl]

OP's EX90 is a fully-electric vehicle with a J1772+CCS1 charge port, so it will accept the unmodified FCSP plug. Overall, OP's strategy does make sense because he has an otherwise-unused FCSP just lying around.

I personally would not recommend the course of action you're contemplating. The FCSP may have temperature sensors in the charge plug. If so, I don't know where they're physically located or how their circuitry is routed. It is possible (and I have no idea how likely) that your modification could compromise sensors such that the unit refuses to charge. Even if the FCSP does work, this sort of modification likely violates electrical and fire-safety codes.

If you have a plug-in hybrid, my suggestion would be to sell the FCSP and purchase a pure-J1772 unit (Autel, ChargePoint, DeWalt, Emporia, Enphase, Flo, and WallBox are all reputable). It will work fine for both the Lightning and any other PHEV or J1772 BEV you might happen to have.

I have heard of folks successfully modifying a J1772-to-Tesla adapter such that they can charge a Tesla EV from the FCSP. You could potentially modify a J1772 extension cord (itself not permitted by the electrical code) in a similar way to achieve the goal you're after.

1) There is no need for modification of the CCS1 plug - the adaption can be achieved by modifying a J1772 plug on an J1772 extension cable so that it fits the top part of the CCS1 plug - so any heat sensors in the CCS1 plug would not be affected. However I have seen no indication that there are any heat sensors in the CCS1 plug of the FCSP from looking at the wiring - the wiring of the plug is the standard CCS1, that is J1772 combined with two pins for DC . If there are any heat sensors, they would be inside the FCSP and at the Lightning charge port. If overheating is sensed at the truck or inside the FCSP, signaling would effect a halt to charging and a fault indication would be displayed on the front of the FCSP.

2) The little piece of plastic removed at the bottom of the J1772 so that it fits the top of the CCS1 should not affect the secure connection of the J1772 since it latches at the top and the rest of the J1772 plug (curved sides etc) keep it aligned with the top of the CCS1 plug.

3) As long at the CCS1 plug and the modified J1772 plug securely seat and latch there should be no heat or fire risk any more that if the J1772 extension was used to extend any other J1772 EVSE output cord.

4) The CCS1 top portion with the J1772 connection is just a standard J1772 plug (see pin out images):

CCS1

J1772

J1772 wires

Information/Description:

SAE J1772 plug: also known as a J plug or Type 1 connector is designed for single phase alternating current electrical systems with 120 VAC or 240 VAC

The Combined Charging System combo 1 (CCS1) connector: builds on the J1772 standard adding two additional pins for DC fast charging up to 350 kW

EVSE Signaling protocol: designed for the following charging sequence:
1) supply equipment signals presence of AC input power
2) vehicle detects plug via proximity circuit (thus the vehicle can prevent driving away while connected) and can detect when latch is pressed in preparation for plug removal.
3) Control Pilot (CP) functions begin
3a) supply equipment detects plug-in electric vehicle (PEV)
3b) supply equipment indicates to PEV readiness to supply current
3c) PEV ventilation requirements are determined
3d) supply equipment current capacity provided to PEV
4) PEV commands energy flow
5) PEV and supply equipment continuously monitor continuity of safety ground
6) charge continues as determined by PEV
7) charge may be interrupted by disconnecting the plug from the vehicle

5) On the FCSP, the DC plug pins are not used unless a Home Integration System (HIS) is installed - the ones in the truck are not energized unless signaled to by the HIS - so there should be no danger of having them uncovered when a modified J1772 is attached. The FCSP is incapable of DC charging or providing DC out on those DC pins.

6) Attached is a PDF of instructions for replacing a FCSP circuit board - I did not note any provision for temperature sensors in the CCS1 plug connection wires.

7) One could, as an alternative, remove and replace the CCS1 cable with an 80A rated J1772 cable on the FCSP if the HIS feature is not going to be used. The Lightning CCS1 port can accept any J1772 EVSE output. The J1772 connections and signalling are standard on the FCSP, as far as I can tell from the wiring diagrams I have seen.

8) Yes modifying a J1772 plug to use with the FCSP CCS1 plug would likely be discouraged by Ford and Seimens, and if botched somehow resulting in damage would be at your own risk. However, from a technical electrical point of view, it would work.

9) There are no commercially available L2 CCS1 to J1772 adapters - and why would there be, CCS1 EVSEs (probably all except the FCSP) are designed for fast DC charging, not L2 charging at home. The CCS1 port on a vehicle allows both fast and L2 charging, the J1772 is the standard for L2 charging used on a plethora of EVs, so incorporating it on the EV CCS1 port allows charging flexibility.

10) To use the FCSP to charge a non-CCS1 EV (with only a J1772 port) has to be a DIY project. But if done, it should be done by someone with the knowledge, skill and expertise to do it correctly. There are some safeguards built in to the FCSP (GFI protection for example) and the J1772 standard, but improper connections can cause serious risks.

11) The NEC code for EVSE plugs (625.10 Electric Vehicle Coupler) has many provisions.
I have read through them and it appears to me that removing the small piece of plastic at the bottom of the J1772 plug would not apparently violate any provision. Note: cable length is not supposed to exceed 25ft from EVSE to EV port, so an extension cable along with the FCSP cable might violate that provision.

The most important provisions are probably these:

A) Construction and Installation. The electric vehicle coupler shall be constructed and installed so as to guard against inadvertent contact by persons with parts made live from the electric vehicle supply equipment or the electric vehicle battery.

B) Unintentional Disconnection. The electric vehicle coupler shall be provided with a positive means to prevent unintentional disconnection.

C) Grounding Pole. The electric vehicle coupler shall be provided with a grounding pole, unless provided as part of a listed isolated electric vehicle supply equipment system.

D) Grounding Pole Requirements. If a grounding pole is provided, the electric vehicle coupler shall be so designed that the grounding pole connection is the first to make and the last to break contact.

and

Interlock. Electric vehicle supply equipment shall be provided with an interlock that de-energizes the electric vehicle connector whenever the electrical connector is uncoupled from the electric vehicle.

These requirements/functions are not disabled by the modification.
-------------------------
Disclaimer

I am an electrical engineer but not a licensed electrician.

The information provided in this post is provided for information purposes only and does not constitute any endorsement or recommendation. No warranty, expressed or implied, is made regarding the accuracy, adequacy, completeness, legality, reliability, or usefulness of any information found in this post. It is your responsibility to verify and investigate this information.

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[lex]

I tested with the J1772 to NACS adapter that came with the lightning. That adapter was designed for the mobile charger cable to charge a tesla from the truck 240volt outlet in the rear.

when shaving that plastic part off and connecting it to the FCSP, CCS cable, it did not work for the Tesla and resulted in charge fault.

 

[lex]

Perhaps my issue was more to do with the particular adapter used than the ability of the FCSP to charge teslas. But if anyone else has been able to successfully charge their Tesla from the FCSP, let us know how you did it.

 

[PJnc284]

iirc a lot of people have had the same issue trying a butchered adapter. Simple fact is ford needs to offer a different cable or adapter or the FCSP will just be an expensive paperweight in the near future.

 

[K6CCC]

My opinion here. Assuming that the Lightning continues, and that the Lightning moves to a NACS connector, Ford will start supplying a version of the FCSP that supports the NACS connector AND an adapter so that older FCSP with CCS-1 connector can connect to new lightnings (and presumably other cars) with NACS charging ports.

And yea, neither of those assumptions are a sure bet...

 

[chl]

My opinion here. Assuming that the Lightning continues, and that the Lightning moves to a NACS connector, Ford will start supplying a version of the FCSP that supports the NACS connector AND an adapter so that older FCSP with CCS-1 connector can connect to new lightnings (and presumably other cars) with NACS charging ports.

And yea, neither of those assumptions are a sure bet...

I think you're right, if the assumptions are correct, but look how long it took to get the NACS to CCS1 adapter, could be long wait. They haven't even started putting the NACS port into Lghtnings yet have they?

If they stick with the HIS system they will need to be sure there is NACS compatibility - I know NACS is bi-directional - maybe it will work, but since the HIS seems to be a proprietary system from Ford, I wonder if there will be any problems...hopefully no prob for the 2% who have a working HIS system.

 

[chl]

Perhaps my issue was more to do with the particular adapter used than the ability of the FCSP to charge teslas. But if anyone else has been able to successfully charge their Tesla from the FCSP, let us know how you did it.

I remember seeing a post by someone who said there was a CCS1 to NACS adapter that worked for DC and AC charging...I think it had a link to it on Amazon.

Might have been this one:

4in1 CCS&J1772 to Tesla/Cybertruck (NACS) Adapter, Fast Charge for Tesla Model 3,S,X,Y,Cybertruck at CCS1 DC Supercharger or AC J1772 Charging Station, Fit for Level 1/2/3 Chargers


https://www.amazon.com/Cybertruck-Adapter-Supercharger-Charging-Chargers/dp/B0DQ3X8FX9

 

[chl]

Perhaps my issue was more to do with the particular adapter used than the ability of the FCSP to charge teslas. But if anyone else has been able to successfully charge their Tesla from the FCSP, let us know how you did it.

I saw a post by someone who said they had done it...I'll see if I can find it...but I think they modified a J1772 to fit the CCS1 like others have tried with J1772 EVs...and apparently "some older Teslas, that don't support CCS charging with Tesla's adapter, still seem to be incompatible with the Charge Station Pro, or with how it negotiates charging."

 

[chl]

You could always use the Tesla mobile charger plugged into the Lightning bed outlet of course.

Or try this one:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DLG2XS2...pin_dp_AW67AWWVE28XQW7RG9PP&previewDoh=1&th=1

 

[chl]

Someone with a Tesla might want to buy one of those from Amazon and test it - Amazon has free returns if it doesn't work.

But the reviewers say it works for both DC and AC charging. But none tried it with a FCSp as far as I could tell.

I posted the Question: Will it work with a Ford Charge Station Pro? at the product page of both of those items.

https://www.amazon.com/Cybertruck-A...0DQ3X8FX9/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

https://www.amazon.com/Upgraded-Sup...XS2H/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8&th=1

 

[chl]

By the way, a while back I looked up how the Tesla/NACS system works.

So in summary, the Tesla the EV checks the plug for AC and if not present assumes DC and acts accordingly to connect without an AC-DC converter.

If Ac is present on the input, it uses the J1772 to detect things as usual, and then connects an AC-DC converter and proceeds to charge the battery.

So technically an adapter that presents AC to the NACS port should proceed with the J1772 protocol.

The attached doc may shed some light/info about the NACS if interested.

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