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NACS-to-NACS extension cable

Maxx

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None of this is about good and evil. It is all business. The profitability of any charging location (EA or Tesla) is measured by the proportion of it's usage to capacity. Opening superchargers may have a little to do with the companies mission but a lot more to do with both short term and long term strategic plan.

A better experience at superchargers for all it's customers is a priority for Tesla and a longer reach will help with that. The question is what is faster and what makes the most sense.

Tesla could make the existing cables longer but that would make it a waste for Tesla's that use those stations.

Or they could sell extensions which could introduce bad connections and more problems over time.

Regardless of how this problem is addressed, we will be paying for it because we caused the problem for coming to the party late. It could be through membership fees, higher rates or directly paying for cables.
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Hank42

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I like what they do in Europe - the owner provides their own cable and plugs into the charger.
 

Maxx

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I like what they do in Europe - the owner provides their own cable and plugs into the charger.
I wonder if that is why charging cables theft is spiking in Europe.
 

Pioneer74

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Just don't use the Tesla Chargers if the cable is not long enough, and you don't want to buy the extension. You can stick to what you have been using.
There are plenty of videos out showing that the current cable is long enough. Barely. But adequate.
 

duncanmaio

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Just don't use the Tesla Chargers if the cable is not long enough, and you don't want to buy the extension. You can stick to what you have been using.
The Supercharger cables aren't long enough to park in the spot intended for the charging pedestal, at least in many cases (and never to back in). Unless there are two charging spots together, or the one all the way to the right with an empty spot next to it, there would be no room to charge even at a half-full Supercharger station.

I don't Supercharge often, but I can see the use case for a cable that allowed me to back in to any available space, or at least to pull in to any available space (and reach across/around the frunk).
 

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Bills R Electric

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There are plenty of videos out showing that the current cable is long enough. Barely. But adequate.
I have used the Tesla MagicDock.
The cable was not long enough. About a foot short.
Both times I charged using the Tesla MagicDock, I had to park sideways - and block 3 spots.
(there were 12 chargers and only one other one was in use)

It will depend on the location.
 

Lytning

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I would rather invest in moving the charge port, or adding a charge port to under the "false door" on the passenger side front fender, and convert it to NACS.
 
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carys98

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I like what they do in Europe - the owner provides their own cable and plugs into the charger.
That’s just for level 2.
 

TheWoo

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That’s just for level 2.
And I can't imagine doing it differently. Cables for DCFC are simply too big and often much more complex for that to make sense.

But I love the way they're building out curbside and lamppost charging infrastructure throughout Europe. It's the long-term answer in cities, IMO.
 

chl

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I'm with you in that I probably wont buy it, as I assume it will be pricey. So we are in the same boat there.

However I do not share what you and many others seem to is a continued animosity towards Tesla. I am VERY APPRECIATVE they opened up NACS, I'm appreciate they got deals done with other Manufacturers to access their network. I'm appreciative I can now road trip my truck with confidence. Do I wish the v3 cables were longer? yes. Do I feel that company owes me this at their extensive cost, no. They made a change in business philosophy, one that, again I am grateful for. I don't feel like they owe me anything. I will be appreciative to have a NACS to NACS extension available in the market because consumer options are good for consumers / users.

They made a very reasonable decision, once I again I am sure correlating with their mid-stream change in strategy regarding their charging network, to make the v4 designs different to still have a nice aesthetic while incorporating a longer cable for other vehicles. Again, I'm appreciative to Tesla for that as well.
Before we go too far down the road of singing Tesla's praises, remember they didn't do it for altruistic reasons, They get federal dollars for doing it that they wouldn't get otherwise, as well as more paying charging customers. So it was a $$ business $$ decision.

That said, glad it happened even if it was because of the legislation that forced their hand.
 

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luebri

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As I stated in post #14 of this thread when someone else made a similar comment. Please review that post and subsequent posts and prove me otherwise because I dont think Gov't money has anything to do with this particular deal.

Please provide your source that they are getting Government Money for the NACS deal with other EV manufacturers. I have heard this stated but never seen any evidence of it.

All the NEVI money requires CCS adapters from my understanding so only new Magic Docks in alignment with that States program and locations would qualify for that program.

Also I dont think really any company does anything for purely "altruistic" reasons and I did not say they did. They made a tactical shift in their strategy that they believe will serve their stockholders better by making more money. This strategy shift happens to be the for benefit of other EV brand owners, especially for Ford owners.
 

luebri

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Before we go too far down the road of singing Tesla's praises, remember they didn't do it for altruistic reasons, They get federal dollars for doing it that they wouldn't get otherwise, as well as more paying charging customers. So it was a $$ business $$ decision.

That said, glad it happened even if it was because of the legislation that forced their hand.
As I stated in post #14 of this thread when someone else made a similar comment. Please review that post and subsequent posts and prove me otherwise because I dont think Gov't money has anything to do with this particular deal.

Please provide your source that they are getting Government Money for the NACS deal with other EV manufacturers. I have heard this stated but never seen any evidence of it.

All the NEVI money requires CCS adapters from my understanding so only new Magic Docks in alignment with that States program and locations would qualify for that program.

Also I dont think really any company does anything for purely "altruistic" reasons and I did not say they did. They made a tactical shift in their strategy that they believe will serve their stockholders better by making more money. This strategy shift happens to be the for benefit of other EV brand owners, especially for Ford owners.
 

chl

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It has been widely reported.
Now of course the Tesla CEO may put a spin on it saying it was planned all along...so who knows for sure, only he does. But money talks and Tesla is a business after all.

"...Though Musk has long toyed with the idea of opening up Tesla's charging network, "no [automakers] ever took him up on it because, frankly, nobody actually took [his plans] seriously," says Sam Abuelsamid, an analyst with Guidehouse Insights who researches the auto industry. So, what changed?

The Biden administration's $7.5 billion investment in EV-charging grants is the catalyst. This federal funding pays private companies to build charging stations, but it comes with a catch: Grantees must include CCS charging plugs at their stations. To access this grant money, Tesla had to open (at least some of) its Supercharger network to CCS-compatible EVs. (Assignment of this grant money occurs at the state level, and Texas and Washington mandate that grantees also include NACS-compatible plugs at their stations.) As the Wall Street Journal reported in September, Tesla is already raking in the lion's share of these grants, helping it grow its Supercharger network at a breakneck pace...."


https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a45972127/tesla-supercharger-network-opening-ev-strategy/
 

djwildstar

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It has been widely reported [...] The Biden administration's $7.5 billion investment in EV-charging grants is the catalyst. This federal funding pays private companies to build charging stations, but it comes with a catch: Grantees must include CCS charging plugs at their stations.
You (and C&D) are conflating two events.

Tesla included the Magic Dock and credit-card readers in the v4 North American SuperCharger so that they could qualify for NEVI money. The legislation specifically requires that the chargers be CCS1 compatible and allow any driver to pay for charging with a credit card. These requirements apply ONLY to the chargers receiving NEVI funding -- specifically, Tesla could deploy some v4 SuperChargers and make them available to all CCS1 vehicles without opening any existing V1, V2, or V3 or other (non-Federally-funded) V4 chargers to non-Tesla owners. The NEVI requirement only applies to the new chargers that are installed with Government money.

Around the same time, Ford and Tesla reached an agreement to allow Ford vehicles to charge at existing (pre-NEVI) V3 SuperChargers and to use plug-and-play at V3 and V4 SuperChargers. In exchange Ford will equip future EVs with the Tesla (NACS) charge connector. Most other EV carmakers followed suit thereafter. However, these agreements do not allow Tesla to qualify for NEVI funding. Even if every automaker in the US had started shipping all vehicles with NACS plugs starting in May 2023, that wouldn't have qualified Tesla for NEVI funding. The law says chargers must have a CCS plug and a credit card reader. It is possible that future rounds of Federal funding will have different rules ... but at this point, another round of Federal funding for chargers isn't guaranteed, let alone what rules will be in effect.

Car and Driver claims that the two events are related in Elon Musk's mind. Maybe they are, and maybe they aren't -- but C&D doesn't provide any proof points other than that the two things happened around the same time and that nobody in the industry took Musk seriously about charging prior to the Ford deal. Absent a statement from Musk, we can't really be sure what he was thinking. What is certain is that there is no law or regulation that makes either event dependent on the other.

It may well be smart business: a deal with all of the major automakers to ensure that their vehicles work best with Tesla's charging network, combined with capturing a huge percentage of the NEVI money to build out that charging network at Federal expense does sound like a good way to become the king of EV "gas stations". Tesla's next challenge will be to ensure that the chargers remain reliable, available, and profitable despite the increased use.
 

Lesrice13

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I personally don't see the need, myself.

Why should I spend my money to make thier product work? Shouldn't Tesla have to make their dispenser compatible to the product they are trying to serve?

I get the adaptor. All vehicles are adopting the same standard, we just got in too early. But without a mandated standardized port location, it's their responsibility, not mine.
WOW. I do most of my charging at home. The reality is when I do take a road trip, the EA (Electrify America) charging stations are poorly maintained, rarely have half or more of the stations working and cause anxiety. The Tesla network is well maintained and more readily available. Why not make the Tesla the standard? They have proven to be the standard all others should aspire to. It is much better to have more options available to charge than fewer. I don't care how much it cost (most Ford folks will get the adapter free)
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