New Lightning owner puzzled at the slow AC charge

[Northcaptain]

Hello to all, i've added a 2025 Lariat with extended battery to my home fleet which has a F350 V10 already and a BWW I4. The Lighting on the first charge from 50% refused to use more than 8 Kw (apart from a small bout of 11 kw). Same thing 2 days later. The truck is new with 150 miles. In the I4 we have a view of what the charging station is offering versus what is the vehicle capability and the result of the negotiation between the 2... which change a lot during a DC charge but not so much in an AC charge. I see people wandering why they can't charge at 19 kw but i can't even touch 11 for all night ! (a call has been made to the Ford dealer we'll see if they can fix this)... Any clue of what is happening and why the truck would limit itself to 8 kw ?

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[flyin525]

Hello to all, i've added a 2025 Lariat with extended battery to my home fleet which has a BWW I4. The Lighting on the first charge from 50% refused to use more than 8 Kw (apart from a small bout of 11 kw). Same thing 2 days later. The truck is new with 150 miles. In the I4 we have a view of what the charging station is offering versus what is the vehicle capability and the result of the negotiation between the 2... which change a lot during a DC charge but not so much in an AC charge. I see people wandering why they can't charge at 19 kw but i can't even touch 11 for all night ! (a call has been made to the Ford dealer we'll see if they can fix this)... Any clue of what is happening and why the truck would limit itself to 8 kw ?

Older vehicles can charge at 80 amps thanks to having dual onboard chargers. 2024+ vehicles can only charge at 48 amps (single onboard charger), unless its a specially ordered fleet vehicle with dual onboard chargers.

48 amps would be 11.5 kW with no losses, realistically you would be looking at about 10 kW.

 

[Northcaptain]

Older vehicles can charge at 80 amps thanks to having dual onboard chargers. 2024+ vehicles can only charge at 48 amps (single onboard charger), unless its a specially ordered fleet vehicle with dual onboard chargers.

48 amps would be 11.5 kW with no losses, realistically you would be looking at about 10 kW.

Yes i've seen the reduction in charge capacity from Ford... but i'm only getting 30A out of a 48A charger...

 

[flyin525]

Yes i've seen the reduction in charge capacity from Ford... but i'm only getting 30A out of a 48A charger...

What equipment are you charging with? The Charge Station Pro? If so there is a hardware switch inside that must be set, there is also a software limit switch in the fordpass app.

 

[Northcaptain]

I've put the limit at 48A in the Fordpass app. The charger is an Autel Max happily charging my BMW at 11 kw all night for the last 2 years.

 

[Scorpio3d]

The only way I can adjust the charge rate in the Ford pass app is if I go into the FCSP settings, but if you are using an autel unit How are you able to adjust the charge rate in the Ford pass app? I’m guessing that is something different with the newer models?? I have a 23 lariat.

 

[Northcaptain]

Let's not forget the charging station is merely a 240 V AC terminal to which the vehicle communicate using 1772 protocols to ask how much amps it can give and then the internal charger of the vehicle ajust itself toward it. Then the charge can start. The charging station is only capable to intervene if the wire get hot or the handle get hot or there's a current leak. Otherwiser its always the vehicle which decide.

The charging speed in AC is programmable in the Fordpass app under the Energy label.

 

[Newton]

Just to confirm, is this a hardwired EVSE on a 60A circuit? Interestingly in the installation instructions I discover that the Autel accepts a maximum of #6 wire and not all #6 is rated for 60A so I hope that you had a good electrician. If you are using the 50A plug then no, you can’t get 11kW although it might let you try. (I’m not a huge fan of EVSEs that come with 50A plugs but let you select above 45A).

It is possible that the BMW is not reporting the kW used correctly, which is better than Ford which does not report it at all without the app.

I’d suggest getting an OBDII dongle and Car Scanner pro to figure out what is going on. Service will probably be useless.

Your max AC charging rate is 11 kW on the new models. The ERs used to charge at a higher rate because they had two internal chargers and Ford removed that feature for all but the fleet models.

 

[Newton]

Let's not forget the charging station is merely a 240 V AC terminal to which the vehicle communicate using 1772 protocols to ask how much amps it can give and then the internal charger of the vehicle ajust itself toward it. Then the charge can start. The charging station is only capable to intervene if the wire get hot or the handle get hot or there's a current leak. Otherwiser its always the vehicle which decide.

The charging speed in AC is programmable in the Fordpass app under the Energy label.

Some EVSEs will detect voltage drop and limit supply (through the protocol) accordingly. It is possible this is what the truck is doing as well. You need the ODBII dongle. I’d also take it to a commercial high amperage AC charger, sometimes hotels have them.

 

[Newton]

Does anybody know what happens when you tell the truck to limit the current to 48A? Does it limit it to 48A or 38.4A (which would be the 80% derating for EVSEs). I could see somebody deciding that the latter was safer.

 

[Northcaptain]

The only way I can adjust the charge rate in the Ford pass app is if I go into the FCSP settings, but if you are using an autel unit How are you able to adjust the charge rate in the Ford pass app? I’m guessing that is something different with the newer models?? I have a 23 lariat.

The charge rate is never managed by the charging station, always by the inboard charger. The charging station is merely just a cable connected to your home electric box with some circuit for protection. It would be double or triple the size if it has to throttle the current. No the load is the car, and the battery management system (BMS) in the car decide how many Amps enters. There is a limit that you can set in the Fordpass app that tells the truck not to take too much. My setup is 48A.

 

[Northcaptain]

Some EVSEs will detect voltage drop and limit supply (through the protocol) accordingly. It is possible this is what the truck is doing as well. You need the ODBII dongle. I’d also take it to a commercial high amperage AC charger, sometimes hotels have them.

Indeed on huge DC charging 150Kw and more but not on AC charging station.

 

[Northcaptain]

Does anybody know what happens when you tell the truck to limit the current to 48A? Does it limit it to 48A or 38.4A (which would be the 80% derating for EVSEs). I could see somebody deciding that the latter was safer.

When you tell the truck to limit itself to any value, it only tell the BMS and the onboard charger not to go over that limit. Thats it. The 80 % or 100% of charge value is another thing. Unless i didn't understand your question ?

 

[Northcaptain]

This is my charge yesterday. 8 kw for some time, a quick happiness at 11kw but for the remaining of the night its 8 kw. This puzzle me a battery so huge why does it takes it time to charge when there is more available.

 

[Northcaptain]

What equipment are you charging with? The Charge Station Pro? If so there is a hardware switch inside that must be set, there is also a software limit switch in the fordpass app.

The switch you refer to is only used by the protocol communication of the charging station to tell the truck "hey i'm 48 A capable". The switch is not linked to any current limiting capacity in the charging station itself.

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