Pro Power for Home Backup Power Enhancement Suggestions

[v2h8484]

Since Ford is known to monitor this forum, I would like to follow up on my post (https://www.f150lightningforum.com/...e-back-up-a-simple-approach.18301/post-367980) with some suggestions for future Pro Power enhancements:

* Make the neutral/ground bond configurable. I believe my post referenced above has further highlighted how the current Pro Power is difficult/costly to make code compliant. Many generators and inverters already have this suggested feature. It could easily be done with an internal relay controlled via the dash so the relay can be set to open on a per session basis. This would allow a much simpler/cheaper connection to house wiring via a interlock or transfer switch. BTW, the Tesla Cybertruck generator doesn't appear to have neutral/ground bond.

* Improve the GFCI and make it configurable. The existing GFCI (class A, <6mA leakage allowed) on the L14-30 outlet is impractical for many single devices let alone all the loads in a typical house. In fact, the class A GFCI has created so many nuisance trip problems that industries are pushing back. See example at (https://www.aham.org/AHAM/Innovatio...spx?hkey=154ea193-af5d-4ff7-8609-39c57eef4cb1). One key issue is that many code compliant class A GFCI are poorly/cheaply implemented and trips much faster than allowed by the relevant standards. Ford's GFCI implementation appears to fall in to this category based on the forum posts about nuisance trips even with neutral transfer switch. GFCI should only trip on overly high 60Hz leakage current but instead it's often tripping on high frequency (>10KHz) transients common in modern electronics (e.g. inverter based appliances). So, Ford should provide a per session configurable option to disable the GFCI on the 240V or improve the GFCI to only trip for 60Hz leakage current with max allowed trip time based on the current level and also allow higher trip limit option (e.g. 20mA would be reasonable). It's no accident that most generators that have GFCI on the 120V outlets don't have it on the 240V outlets.

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[duncanmaio]

He's talking to you, @Ford Motor Company

 

[hturnerfamily]

the several times I've used the ProPower 30amp outlet to power my home's main panel, I've not experienced any 'GFCI' or 'Nuisance' tripping... I do realize, though, that some home's GFCI circuits, or GFCI outlets, don't always 'play well' with other GFCI upstream counterparts...this happens a lot in the RV world, too, where a campground's GFCI outlet or circuit causes tripping from the Camper, although at other campgrounds there are no issues when the same camper is plugged into their circuits...
I realize that most owners won't go my direct-to-panel wiring style, but it works for me.

 

[Howard_Scott_Warshaw]

I'd suggest partnering with an EVSE manufacturer who's already developing in the V2H space like Emporia.

https://www.emporiaenergy.com/how-the-emporia-v2x-charger-works/

 

[PreservedSwine]

the several times I've used the ProPower 30amp outlet to power my home's main panel, I've not experienced any 'GFCI' or 'Nuisance' tripping... I do realize, though, that some home's GFCI circuits, or GFCI outlets, don't always 'play well' with other GFCI upstream counterparts...this happens a lot in the RV world, too, where a campground's GFCI outlet or circuit causes tripping from the Camper, although at other campgrounds there are no issues when the same camper is plugged into their circuits...
I realize that most owners won't go my direct-to-panel wiring style, but it works for me.

I’ve heard many people say over the years that more than 1 GFCI may cause another trip. But no one can actually say why.

i don’t believe that to be true. I never say never, but it’s been my experience, If a gfci is tripping, there’s either a defective gfci, or there’s current leakage. There’s nothing wrong with multiple GFCI’s on a service, provided everything is wired properly.

 

[Maquis]

I’ve heard many people say over the years that more than 1 GFCI may cause another trip. But no one can actually say why.

They can’t say why because it’s untrue. If that were the case, none of those curling irons and blow dryers that have a GFCI built into the plug could be used in a bathroom with GFCI-protected receptacles.

 

[DennisM1]

I have the Ford/Sunrun system and have been working with Ford support for months trying to get the system working reliably without success. The latest is that they say they have an engineer with a solution soon but I’ve invested thousands in the system and can’t get it operational.

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