The Lightning had working prototypes pulling trains on camera more than 2 years before orders opened up. Where's the T3?

[KevinC]

With a build timeframe of 2025 it seems like we should have at least started seeing some prototypes. Specs would be nice even if it's just measurements. At least give me a chance to see if it's too ugly or not so I can decide if i should take advantage of the lightning price drops. It makes me wonder if it's so behind that they dont wan't to talk about it if they can avoid it. The Cybertruck had prototypes 4 years in advance.

It's quiet. ..... Too Quiet.

If the T3 is delayed will they add on another year of lightning production?

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[Monkey]

T3 is double top secret. We'll see it when it's mostly done and they're about ready to start taking orders. I don't think the Lightning is going anywhere, even after T3 arrives. They'll keep the Lightning as the BEV drivetrain option for the standard F-150 line.

 

[vandy1981]

I don't think the Lightning is going anywhere, even after T3 arrives.

@Pioneer74 seems to know what's up and they say Ford has no plans to engineer an all-electric drivetrain for the next-gen F150, so T3 will be a complete fork. I think the next F150 is due in 2025 or 2026.

It makes me wonder if it's so behind that they dont wan't to talk about it if they can avoid it. The Cybertruck had prototypes 4 years in advance.

This is a complete guess, but I bet Ford will release some information around the time of Tesla's promised delivery event in Q3. Can't see a lot of benefit in releasing a lot of information that might make it harder to sell the one they have.

 

[swajames]

Ford isn’t going to show the next gen until much closer to launch this time around. It’s one thing to show prototypes when you’ve nothing else to sell (as we saw with the Lightning prototypes and see today with Cybertruck), it’s another to show what’s coming in the future when you’re still selling the current product that it will replace.

 

[HammaHamma]

If they're smart about it, it won't share the F150's body, though will be inspired by it / share design cues. Shrink the frontal area putting it into bed length instead. 6.5' bed, OAL at 19' 7". Monocoque w/ structural LMFP battery in flavors of 350 and 500 mile EPA ranges at ~800v.
10kW+ V2x capability native with plug arrangement similar to how 7.2kW system works now, but can output it on the NACS connector allowing for convenient V2x capabilities (with a healthy 40% 6 second surge capability). The only requirement for split-phase power application via NACS is to have a communication box / auto transformer (again, using open protocols and thus 3rd party products) to take the singe phase 240v and convert it to split phase 240v. No more key-on condition for power output -- would be auto if connected to charger, phone control and monitoring standard.

Given that ford is trying to in-house as much of the components as possible, I do question just how innovative they're going to be. This new platform better 'wow' the industry and customers with ideas like what the 7.2kW PPOB did. Not interested in some half-baked shit like the hummer and silverado have going on.

The original lightning proto e-truck was on a 13th gen platform to say 'look what we can do' -- not to showcase the actual truck itself.

 

[Heliian]

Monocoque w/ structural LMFP battery in

I don't see how that combination will sell to serious truck users for a long while.

 

[vandy1981]

I don't see how that combination will sell to serious truck users for a long while.

Just call it unibody on frame, like the StraightPipes Youtube guys suggested.

 

[Bills R Electric]

With a build timeframe of 2025 it seems like we should have at least started seeing some prototypes. Specs would be nice even if it's just measurements. At least give me a chance to see if it's too ugly or not so I can decide if i should take advantage of the lightning price drops. It makes me wonder if it's so behind that they dont wan't to talk about it if they can avoid it. The Cybertruck had prototypes 4 years in advance.

It's quiet. ..... Too Quiet.

If the T3 is delayed will they add on another year of lightning production?

You mean the next Generation Lightning that will be built in Tennessee?

I don't expect to see prototypes or spy photos for at least another year. My guess is the Tennessee plant goes live mid 2025.

But I suppose we might a glimpse of what it might look like on the outside before then if someone leaks it. Although, based on the Chevy Silverado EV, and the current Lightning, I don't expect it to look radically different. It won't be any crazy Cybertruck type design IMO. Please please keep the big Frunk.

 

[RickLightning]

Ford isn’t going to show the next gen until much closer to launch this time around. It’s one thing to show prototypes when you’ve nothing else to sell (as we saw with the Lightning prototypes and see today with Cybertruck), it’s another to show what’s coming in the future when you’re still selling the current product that it will replace.

Yup. The minute they show it, sales of the Lightning drop off.

 

[Heliian]

please keep the big Frunk.

Unfortunately, I feel that the current frunk is going to be the biggest ever in an ev and it's all going to be smaller from here on in as the aero design catches up.

 

[Bills R Electric]

Unfortunately, I feel that the current frunk is going to be the biggest ever in an ev and it's all going to be smaller from here on in as the aero design catches up.

My fear too.

Honestly it is the main reason I picked the Lightning over the Rivian. I could have taken delivery of either one at the same time, but after trying out both in person....the Frunk in the Lightning was hands down more useful than the Rivian's. The gear tunnel is a cool idea but didn't seem as useful.

(The 2nd main reason was the size of the back seat. If you want more space, the Ford is way ahead of the Rivian. Both are good vehicles though)

 

[Pioneer74]

T3 is double top secret. We'll see it when it's mostly done and they're about ready to start taking orders. I don't think the Lightning is going anywhere, even after T3 arrives. They'll keep the Lightning as the BEV drivetrain option for the standard F-150 line.

I'm being told that there will be no electric version of the gas truck. When the T3 Lightning launches, production at the Dearborn plant will cease. Then Dearborn will be retooled for the next gen ICE truck, and I'm hearing it will be a ground up redesign. Probably the last ICE F150 platform.

 

[Pioneer74]

With a build timeframe of 2025 it seems like we should have at least started seeing some prototypes. Specs would be nice even if it's just measurements. At least give me a chance to see if it's too ugly or not so I can decide if i should take advantage of the lightning price drops. It makes me wonder if it's so behind that they dont wan't to talk about it if they can avoid it. The Cybertruck had prototypes 4 years in advance.

It's quiet. ..... Too Quiet.

If the T3 is delayed will they add on another year of lightning production?

From the little information I know, there are current Lightning trucks fitted with the prototype next-gen drivetrains driving around. You probably won't see a full production ready prototype driving around until next year.

It was easy to make an early production Lightning and that it why you saw it so early. All they had to do was build a truck, take the ICE drivetrain out and install the electric drivetrain. The new truck is totally different.

I don't have a lot of information on the new Lightning because the engineers I get my information from aren't working on it. They are working on the next gen ICE truck. I have some good dirt on that.

 

[djwildstar]

Ford has been clear that T3 is a new vehicle that isn't an F-150 (and also isn't an F-250 or F-350). They've also stated that the T3 will be built at the new Blue Oval City plant in Tennessee. Since this is projected to come on-line sometime in 2025, I'm expecting very limited production for the 2025 model year, and full production for the 2026 model year.

I suspect that Ford is being super-top-secret about the T3 because they don't want the "Osbourne effect" to cannabilize sales of their existing BEV pickup truck. While we may get more teasers about the T3 trucks, I doubt we'll get any solid information for another year or so.

My personal thoughts on 2nd-generation Lightning and T3 are:

• F-150 Lightning:
  • The Lightning will continue to be the BEV version of an F-150 for at least the 9th generation of the F-150. Ford redesigns the F-150 about every 5-6 years.
    • Ford will continue producing the current F-150 Lightning for the 2024 model year, with no changes to range or performance.
    • Ford may use a LiPo battery for the SR trucks to keep costs down.
    • The 2024 models will include a Tesla to CCS adapter with the truck. The adapter will be available for purchase by 2022-2024 owners.
    • The 2025 model year will definitely include the NACS charge port in place of the CCS charge port.
  • I suspect that Ford will continue offering a BEV F-150 (and likely under the Lightning sub-brand) for the 10th generation. This could be as early as the 2025 model year.
    • Since I don't expect the T3 to start shipping until well into the 2025 model year, it may make sense for Ford to release a 2nd-generation F-150 Lightning for the 2025 model year, to keep sales strong.
    • For a 2nd generation, I would expect to see an 800V battery architecture to improve charging speeds.
    • I would expect it to remain as F-150-compatible as possible so that it retains compatibility with bed and cabin accessories.
    • Efficiency increases (such as a heat pump) along with incremental improvement in battery capacity may increase range slightly.
• T3:
  • I expect that T3 will be a modular approach that is adaptable to a couple of different platforms and could make at least two, and possibly as many as five different vehicles. I would expect key features to include:
    • 800V battery architecture with 3 or 4 different sizes of battery packs
    • Common motor, control, charging, and V2H/V2G components all developed in-house by Ford.
    • A next-generation infotainment system.
    • A focus on efficiency including heat pump and aerodynamics.
  • These components could be organized into one of two platforms:
    • A midsize body-on-frame platform that could support:
      • A midsize BEV pickup truck (an electric Ranger) and
      • A midsize SUV (an electric Bronco)
    • A compact unibody platform that could support:
      • A compact BEV pickup truck (an electric Maverick)
      • A compact crossover SUV (an electric Escape), and
      • A compact sport SUV (an electric Bronco Sport).
  • It is likely that Ford will focus on one of these two platforms first (with some 2025 model year availability and full production for the 2026 model year) and the other coming next (for the 2026 or 2027 model years).
    • Given that the Maverick outsells the Ranger, and Bronco Sport outsells the Bronco, I'd put money on the compact unibody platform first.
  • I would expect standard-range and extended-range batteries to be offered, with standard-range models having ranges somewhere in the low- to mid-300 miles, and extended range batteries offering in the mid-400 mile zone.

 

[sotek2345]

Ford has been clear that T3 is a new vehicle that isn't an F-150 (and also isn't an F-250 or F-350). They've also stated that the T3 will be built at the new Blue Oval City plant in Tennessee. Since this is projected to come on-line sometime in 2025, I'm expecting very limited production for the 2025 model year, and full production for the 2026 model year.

I suspect that Ford is being super-top-secret about the T3 because they don't want the "Osbourne effect" to cannabilize sales of their existing BEV pickup truck. While we may get more teasers about the T3 trucks, I doubt we'll get any solid information for another year or so.

My personal thoughts on 2nd-generation Lightning and T3 are:

• F-150 Lightning:
  • The Lightning will continue to be the BEV version of an F-150 for at least the 9th generation of the F-150. Ford redesigns the F-150 about every 5-6 years.
    • Ford will continue producing the current F-150 Lightning for the 2024 model year, with no changes to range or performance.
    • Ford may use a LiPo battery for the SR trucks to keep costs down.
    • The 2024 models will include a Tesla to CCS adapter with the truck. The adapter will be available for purchase by 2022-2024 owners.
    • The 2025 model year will definitely include the NACS charge port in place of the CCS charge port.
  • I suspect that Ford will continue offering a BEV F-150 (and likely under the Lightning sub-brand) for the 10th generation. This could be as early as the 2025 model year.
    • Since I don't expect the T3 to start shipping until well into the 2025 model year, it may make sense for Ford to release a 2nd-generation F-150 Lightning for the 2025 model year, to keep sales strong.
    • For a 2nd generation, I would expect to see an 800V battery architecture to improve charging speeds.
    • I would expect it to remain as F-150-compatible as possible so that it retains compatibility with bed and cabin accessories.
    • Efficiency increases (such as a heat pump) along with incremental improvement in battery capacity may increase range slightly

Ok - I am really curious on how your are counting F150 generations. As far as I know, we are currently in the 14th generation....

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