Tough decision….but its time….

[Robocop]

On topic to this discussion, I really don't understand going from a lightning over to a Rivian. It certainly is not a financial decision. The only rational answer I have seen is the person who needed the vehicle to fit in their garage. Even that for me would have been to park in the driveway rather than lose all that money. I bought my lightning at one of the most expensive MSRP out there (luckily bought on 12/31 and got the 2022 tax credit on the 23 model). I would never consider trading this for another EV truck. There is simply no reason even remotely good enough to spend all that money (even the longer range of the GMC/Chevy).

Hard agree with this take. I'd go further though to include the batch of people doing the lightning => newer lightning "upgrade." Whether leased or financed, it is just hemorrhaging money for no good reason.

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[EV Engineer]

Congrats?

What is the appeal of a RIvian over a lightning?

They're smaller, more expensive, harder to get repaired, less aftermarket parts, less V2H options and trivially more 'efficient'.

I can kind of understand cybertruck and GMC models. And I can understand new rivian purchases (slightly)

But switching to a rivian from a lightning makes 0 sense to me.

I am genuinely curious?


I just road tripped 1000 miles in about 3 weeks and there's really nothing I would change with the lightning. I mean I guess the software navigation is lame but google / Apple maps is on my phone and doesn't cost me $1000 a month in depreciation.

 

[Daragh]

Congrats?

What is the appeal of a RIvian over a lightning?

They're smaller, more expensive, harder to get repaired, less aftermarket parts, less V2H options and trivially more 'efficient'.

I can kind of understand cybertruck and GMC models. And I can understand new rivian purchases (slightly)

But switching to a rivian from a lightning makes 0 sense to me.

I am genuinely curious?


I just road tripped 1000 miles in about 3 weeks and there's really nothing I would change with the lightning. I mean I guess the software navigation is lame but google / Apple maps is on my phone and doesn't cost me $1000 a month in depreciation.

I’m not knocking the Lightning as many seem to think, this is simply a personal preference and choice, like what’s my favorite beer or color etc. and as I mentioned in my second post I understand people will have different opinions and thats perfectly ok, thats their personal choice.

But to try answer some of the points you highlighted:

Size differential is irrelevant for my use and needs, I don’t agree the Rivians are harder to repair from the reviews I’ve read its on par with Lightning. I have never used nor wanted V2H with my lightning.

Rivian will depreciate in line with Lightning, technology and road map of future improvements is more assured and significantly better at present with Rivian (assuming they survive which personally I think they will). Software is updated in a timely and periodic manner, EV’s are software based vehicles like it or not.

Simple reality is I no longer want to own my Lightning. I actually looked at going back to an F250 Powerstroke but ironically that would have been even more expensive (as I built it)than the Rivian to purchase and I really don't need that much truck And I prefer the ride and power/torque in an EV.

Hope this helps with the curiosity.

 

[Altivec]

I get it if you came on here and said, I always wanted a Rivian, I think it suits my lifestyle better so I am switching. Great? Nobody could argue that, But you didn't. You came on here saying that you are switching because Ford cancelled the lightning and making EREV's now. and because your dealer happens to employ morons that don't know EV's. You also said that the depreciation is in line with the lightning, which it true, but you are viewing it incorrectly.

As stated. Ford making EREV's or if they continued on and released the T3 in a couple of years would have been the same result for us current Lightning owners. In other words, it changes nothing. The T3 would be a completely different platform with no shared parts. Ford supports their models for a minimum of 10 years so this should have no bearing on switching. As mentioned, if this is truly a concern, you are taking an even bigger chance with a start up, that is struggling to survive.

You being upset with your dealer/service centre is a problem. The issue I have with that comment is it's very subjective. I too had a problem with the service centre that I bought the truck from (ie. lack of EV knowledge). But in the city I live in, I have more than 20 Ford dealerships with in 30min of me. I just kept switching until I found one that I liked with techs that are very knowledgable of EV's. When I was first looking, I considered a Rivian. The number one reason it got axed off the list right away was service. They had one service centre in a city that was 3hrs away from me. You were required to make an appointment 2 weeks in advance and if your truck broke down outside their service area, it was up to you to get it there. Sorry, but if my truck breaks down, I am not waiting two weeks, and dealing with towing it to another city. So off the list it went. I am not sure if things changed in the last couple of years but I am sure they are no Ford, where I can drop in unannounced in just about any town or city I happen to be around. To me, there is huge value in Ford being a juggernaut.

Now when you say the depreciation is similar, you are right. But depreciation is not linear. You take the biggest "hit" the second you drive the truck off the lot. First year is 30%, and then it slows down as it gets older and the more miles you drive it. You already took the big hit off the lightning and would take much smaller hits each year you kept it. By switching to another NEW vehicle, you are once again, taking the BIG hit. That's your prerogative. Some people have money and don't care. They want what they want. Again, if you came here and said I love the Rivian, it fits my life better, and could care less that its going to cost me a small fortune to switch, I would be cool man, good for you. Where the confusion comes in is that you say you love the lightning but are mad at EREV's, and your one sucky service centre. I'm saying, you are switching, with all those risks and costs, just for that. Okay man...

 

[Daragh]

I get it if you came on here and said, I always wanted a Rivian, I think it suits my lifestyle better so I am switching. Great? Nobody could argue that, But you didn't. You came on here saying that you are switching because Ford cancelled the lightning and making EREV's now. and because your dealer happens to employ morons that don't know EV's. You also said that the depreciation is in line with the lightning, which it true, but you are viewing it incorrectly.

As stated. Ford making EREV's or if they continued on and released the T3 in a couple of years would have been the same result for us current Lightning owners. In other words, it changes nothing. The T3 would be a completely different platform with no shared parts. Ford supports their models for a minimum of 10 years so this should have no bearing on switching. As mentioned, if this is truly a concern, you are taking an even bigger chance with a start up, that is struggling to survive.

You being upset with your dealer/service centre is a problem. The issue I have with that comment is it's very subjective. I too had a problem with the service centre that I bought the truck from (ie. lack of EV knowledge). But in the city I live in, I have more than 20 Ford dealerships with in 30min of me. I just kept switching until I found one that I liked with techs that are very knowledgable of EV's. When I was first looking, I considered a Rivian. The number one reason it got axed off the list right away was service. They had one service centre in a city that was 3hrs away from me. You were required to make an appointment 2 weeks in advance and if your truck broke down outside their service area, it was up to you to get it there. Sorry, but if my truck breaks down, I am not waiting two weeks, and dealing with towing it to another city. So off the list it went. I am not sure if things changed in the last couple of years but I am sure they are no Ford, where I can drop in unannounced in just about any town or city I happen to be around. To me, there is huge value in Ford being a juggernaut.

Now when you say the depreciation is similar, you are right. But depreciation is not linear. You take the biggest "hit" the second you drive the truck off the lot. First year is 30%, and then it slows down as it gets older and the more miles you drive it. You already took the big hit off the lightning and would take much smaller hits each year you kept it. By switching to another NEW vehicle, you are once again, taking the BIG hit. That's your prerogative. Some people have money and don't care. They want what they want. Again, if you came here and said I love the Rivian, it fits my life better, and could care less that its going to cost me a small fortune to switch, I would be cool man, good for you. Where the confusion comes in is that you say you love the lightning but are mad at EREV's, and your one sucky service centre. I'm saying, you are switching, with all those risks and costs, just for that. Okay man...

I appreciate your viewpoint, and I do care about costs but it’s not always the first or most critical factor in my decision making.

I guess the fundamental core is I am not nor have I been happy with Ford service and software support with the Lightning prior to discontinuation and I don’t expect this to get any better moving forward. This is a core part of a software based vehicle which all EVs are. For the record I still own and will continue to own several Ford ICE vehicles that I am very happy with.

I am very fortunate that I can afford to absorb the depreciation hit on the Rivian having already incurred it on the Lightning.

I’m comfortable taking the unknown risk(s) with Rivian. If you don’t take some risks life would be boring . Rivian are a vertically integrated design and manufacturing company which in my view is key to any modern EV vehicles success given my experience with my Lightning. Others disagree and again I respect that viewpoint whilst disagreeing with it!

Cost of ownership did not gate my decision in moving to a Rivian. Technology roadmap did. I realize this is alien to many folks and perhaps rightly so but that’s just how I feel.

I’m not trying to convince anyone else to make a similar decision. I just wanted to share my frustration in a way, maybe I shouldn’t have posted my original post but I did so here we are.

I truly wish all Lightning owners continued enjoyment with their trucks it just didn’t work out for me this time!

Stay charged!

 

[Lightning Rod]

I too am upset that the Lightning has been canceled. I still am fully satisfied with my 37 months of ownership with my Lariat ER.

Like others have said... please check in every once in a while and share your experience.

Good luck.

 

[TaxmanHog]

I’m not trying to convince anyone else to make a similar decision. I just wanted to share my frustration in a way, maybe I shouldn’t have posted my original post but I did so here we are.

Nope, sad to see you moving along but understand your POV and thanks for sharing it.

 

[Altivec]

I appreciate your viewpoint, and I do care about costs but it’s not always the first or most critical factor in my decision making.

I guess the fundamental core is I am not nor have I been happy with Ford service and software support with the Lightning prior to discontinuation and I don’t expect this to get any better moving forward. This is a core part of a software based vehicle which all EVs are. For the record I still own and will continue to own several Ford ICE vehicles that I am very happy with.

I am very fortunate that I can afford to absorb the depreciation hit on the Rivian having already incurred it on the Lightning.

I’m comfortable taking the unknown risk(s) with Rivian. If you don’t take some risks life would be boring . Rivian are a vertically integrated design and manufacturing company which in my view is key to any modern EV vehicles success given my experience with my Lightning. Others disagree and again I respect that viewpoint whilst disagreeing with it!

Cost of ownership did not gate my decision in moving to a Rivian. Technology roadmap did. I realize this is alien to many folks and perhaps rightly so but that’s just how I feel.

I’m not trying to convince anyone else to make a similar decision. I just wanted to share my frustration in a way, maybe I shouldn’t have posted my original post but I did so here we are.

I truly wish all Lightning owners continued enjoyment with their trucks it just didn’t work out for me this time!

Stay charged!

Don't get me wrong... I appreciate you coming here and sharing your point a view. I just wasn't understanding it. Although I still disagree with why, I better understand you now. So thanks for clarifying.

Also... I am in agreement with you 100%. Vehicles are now computers on wheels and if the company doesn't understand that software is the number one thing that customers interact with and will judge you on, they are doomed to fail. I too was fooled into believing Ford understood this. I am equally frustrated with their lack of development (and complete disregard to what customers are asking for) when it comes to OTA's. I am also equally disappointed with Ford's cancellation of the lightning. Even more, I am baffled at the cancellation of the T3 and as you said the choices they are making for their future road map. It clearly doesn't align with either of us.

In saying that. I am also like you, where I get a new vehicle around 7 to 8 years. I am only two years in. I did all my research 2 years ago and made the best decision for me at that time. I looked at Rivians, Cybertruck, and the Silverado EV. I am sure I could come up with reasons every year of why I should change trucks but that wouldn't be smart financially on my end. I guess for me, my hate for Fords decisions has not reached the point where I would change my buying schedule from 7 to 8 years to 2. Like you, I still love the truck so it's not like I got a lemon where I just can't stand the thing and need to get rid of it. Where this will take effect for me is in about 5 years from now. For the reasons you stated (No BEV F150 and abysmal at software), there is less than a 1% chance that I will be buying a Ford again.

Anyways... It was nice chatting with you. I wish you the best with your new ride. As others said, it would be great if you popped by once in a while and provided some feedback, both good and bad. It's always good to hear from people that have real world experiences with multiple brands.

 

[electricpig]

I appreciate your viewpoint, and I do care about costs but it’s not always the first or most critical factor in my decision making.

I guess the fundamental core is I am not nor have I been happy with Ford service and software support with the Lightning prior to discontinuation and I don’t expect this to get any better moving forward. This is a core part of a software based vehicle which all EVs are. For the record I still own and will continue to own several Ford ICE vehicles that I am very happy with.

I am very fortunate that I can afford to absorb the depreciation hit on the Rivian having already incurred it on the Lightning.

I’m comfortable taking the unknown risk(s) with Rivian. If you don’t take some risks life would be boring . Rivian are a vertically integrated design and manufacturing company which in my view is key to any modern EV vehicles success given my experience with my Lightning. Others disagree and again I respect that viewpoint whilst disagreeing with it!

Cost of ownership did not gate my decision in moving to a Rivian. Technology roadmap did. I realize this is alien to many folks and perhaps rightly so but that’s just how I feel.

I’m not trying to convince anyone else to make a similar decision. I just wanted to share my frustration in a way, maybe I shouldn’t have posted my original post but I did so here we are.

I truly wish all Lightning owners continued enjoyment with their trucks it just didn’t work out for me this time!

Stay charged!

That you want to is enough reason if it's not going to be a problem for you or anyone else financially. I often tell people to save yea, but what the hell are you working for?

FWIW, I love my Lightning, I would still like to have the R1T. I like that it is different, and is pure EV company. I would but they are just too expensive for me, and service center is 4 hours away. The A.O. drives a Model Y. She loves the car, but hates Tesla (she bought it before all the Elon extras), and plans to move to R2 at some point. She would do so even if without the other factors

Congratulations on the new ride, and please post here about it.

 

[CD4TNF]

The Rivian community is an awesome friendly bunch every time I've met a Rivian owner. Glad you're putting your money in supporting the younger American Auto manufacturer who we desperately need now to spur competitive innovation.

Enjoy the R1T!

 

[tearitupsports]

I am totally ok with the "I just want a change and can afford it" analysis. I bought this truck, my solar system, and my home backup battery V2X all with the same argument. Most people are not honest with themselves about how few financial decisions have a ROI, and how unnecessary that actually is.

I am truly curious about a couple of points you made, however.
You mention that your use case is local events, and kids sports. As someone who has 2 canopies, 4 folding chairs, 4 bleacher seats, a wagon, an electric cooler, baseball bag, soccer bag, and various other things like camera tripods...how can you go without the space and power of the lightning?

I also discern that your only real hang-up is the software, but what specifically about the software is an issue? Yes the OTA update process for Ford is trash. I am real with myself though and have come to the conclusion that there is nothing in them that I need at this point. I have turned OTA's off from installing automatically, and could care less if I get another one or not. What specifically about the lightning do you need at this point? Also what does the Rivian have specifically in software that makes it so much better for you?

I constantly have issues with the Ford App, because the lightning's modem dies out and stops communicating or reporting. With that I also came to the conclusion that I really don't care about or need the app for anything. I am sure there are vehicles with way better apps, but again I would never sacrifice all the things that are amazing with the lightning for a better phone app experience.

Are you able to give more details about the software differences between these? I really am curious because I just assume that they are about same. I am probably wrong.

 

[ctuan13]

Congratulations ! As long you didn’t go to a Silverado Ev I considered one went on their forums holy crap, do have issues!,, makes the Lighting seem
Like a Toyota by comparison … so many ppl and even brand new 26s , too , some ppl
Claim it was just the first year that had issues , it’s not ! Lots of Hv battery issues

Damn, is it really that bad with the GM ultium trucks???

 

[Maineiac12]

Good luck! I considered Rivian but for some reason they don’t lease in my state and the nearest service center is 3 hours away from where I live.

 

[Maineiac12]

Hard agree with this take. I'd go further though to include the batch of people doing the lightning => newer lightning "upgrade." Whether leased or financed, it is just hemorrhaging money for no good reason.

Not every purchase decision is or needs to be rational. If some people can afford it, who cares how they spend their money?

I upgraded to a newer Lightning from an older one because I got a Flash for $49k and 0% APR. My payments went down and I got a newer version of the truck I loved. Win in my book.

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