What to do with spare ER batteries - Buy the matching truck?

[milleniumfalcon]

I currently have a 2022 Lightning Pro with the SR (standard range) battery. I'm very happy with the vehicle but have found the SR battery slightly limiting.

I've been given two extra (loose, detached from truck) ER (extended range) batteries. I am trying to decide what to do (if anything) with these spare batteries. They could be cannibalized for modules in another lightning battery, cannibalized for stationary use with a solar array, or installed as a full pack in an ER truck.

I am considering buying a used ER truck, ideally at a discount due to high mileage, on the theory that I have a replacement battery on the shelf waiting. I don't know if this is a good idea. Ideally I'd find a truck that needs a replacement battery immediately and is priced correspondingly, but most are still under warranty so this seems unlikely.

My theory is that the batteries are the high-value part likely to need replacing first. Aluminum body should be good for a long time, motors good for a long time, suspension and steering repairs relatively inexpensive. Wiring/charging problems unknown but hopefully not too expensive to repair if required. Please let me know if you disagree.

What are we expecting to see for lifespan mileage of these batteries? I'm currently driving around 40k km per year and am guessing a utilized battery would be ready for replacement around the 250k km mark. That's an un-informed guess (250k km lifespan) I've been using when thinking about storing a spare battery for several years on a shelf. What do you think about the expected battery lifespan? Mostly Level 2 AC charging at home. I'm thinking I could take an ER lightning to >500k km on two batteries (one original, one replacement) without major repairs (assuming no accidents).

Maybe I'm being pessimistic about the battery lifespan, and we're all going to get 400k km on our batteries without serious range degradation - I'm not particularly informed on this topic and made up the 250k km estimate.

What do we think the battery market is going to look like in five years? In ten years? There's little point planning around OEM batteries if we think after-market batteries are going to be plentiful/cheap/better. My working assumption is that I'd drive the truck a fair bit and be ready to swap batteries in <5 years, and that at this point the technology won't have changed enough for the free spare OEM battery not to be attractive. This assumes I buy a relatively high-mileage truck and the battery lifespan isn't exceptional.

What do we think will happen to a battery stored on a shelf for 5 years? Any ideas for how to maintain battery health over this period? I'm realizing I may need/want to keep the battery from freezing.

Questions that are maybe more appropriate for the dealership:
Does anyone know if it's possible to test battery health detached from the vehicle? I can call the dealership. No point planning around batteries that are in poor health.

Does anyone know about battery compatibility between model years? One of the batteries has a 2023 stamp with 143.4kWh marked.


Thanks for any advice you're able to share.

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[SpaceEVDriver]

The assumption that the battery will need to be replaced first is faulty. The battery will outlast the rest of the vehicle.

As a whole home backup, that 143 kWh is worth about $100k if you compare it with a brand-T powerwall, and that's including the inverter hardware you would have to purchase. It's worth about $80k compared to cheaper whole home battery backups.

If I had been gifted it, I would get a high-voltage inverter/charger and run the house on it, charging from solar. I've considered picking up such a battery from copart exactly for this purpose.

The battery will last longer going through charge cycles than if it's sitting.

 

[RocketGhost]

There really isn't a present market value for the batteries to be used as replacements in a truck. Few are out of warranty, and the nature of these batteries is that failures happen early on, during warranty. So far people with higher mileage report very little degradation. If a battery is going to just fail, it will almost certainly happen during warranty, and degradation is so little the battery will outlast the rest of the truck. Keep in mind degradation just lowers capacity and range. Even at higher losses of capacity many people will just live with it.

At some point yes, there will be a market for used batteries as replacements. There will be failures out of warranty, although likely uncommon.

I do not know if it is possible to replace a SR battery with an ER battery. If so, there's a potential market there.

 

[Bigisland Guy]

You may want to consider researching the Nissan Leaf used battery situation. The leaf is an early EV that has a market for batteries and you may find factors that will persuade you to use the packs in other than EV uses now rather then wait for an ER. If EV used battery trends continue the Leaf second use may expand.

 

[tearitupsports]

See if there is a way to use them for home battery storage. Do you have the connection for the charge port with them?

 

[astrand1]

I think a better question might be what do you mean you were “given” 2 battery packs? Do you work at a ford store or something? Those are not cheap.

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I think a better question might be what do you mean you were “given” to battery packs? Do you work at a ford store or something? Those are not cheap.

And how do we get in on that kind of deal?

 

[The Weatherman]

I currently have a 2022 Lightning Pro with the SR (standard range) battery. I'm very happy with the vehicle but have found the SR battery slightly limiting.

I've been given two extra (loose, detached from truck) ER (extended range) batteries. I am trying to decide what to do (if anything) with these spare batteries. They could be cannibalized for modules in another lightning battery, cannibalized for stationary use with a solar array, or installed as a full pack in an ER truck.

I am considering buying a used ER truck, ideally at a discount due to high mileage, on the theory that I have a replacement battery on the shelf waiting. I don't know if this is a good idea. Ideally I'd find a truck that needs a replacement battery immediately and is priced correspondingly, but most are still under warranty so this seems unlikely.

My theory is that the batteries are the high-value part likely to need replacing first. Aluminum body should be good for a long time, motors good for a long time, suspension and steering repairs relatively inexpensive. Wiring/charging problems unknown but hopefully not too expensive to repair if required. Please let me know if you disagree.

What are we expecting to see for lifespan mileage of these batteries? I'm currently driving around 40k km per year and am guessing a utilized battery would be ready for replacement around the 250k km mark. That's an un-informed guess (250k km lifespan) I've been using when thinking about storing a spare battery for several years on a shelf. What do you think about the expected battery lifespan? Mostly Level 2 AC charging at home. I'm thinking I could take an ER lightning to >500k km on two batteries (one original, one replacement) without major repairs (assuming no accidents).

Maybe I'm being pessimistic about the battery lifespan, and we're all going to get 400k km on our batteries without serious range degradation - I'm not particularly informed on this topic and made up the 250k km estimate.

What do we think the battery market is going to look like in five years? In ten years? There's little point planning around OEM batteries if we think after-market batteries are going to be plentiful/cheap/better. My working assumption is that I'd drive the truck a fair bit and be ready to swap batteries in <5 years, and that at this point the technology won't have changed enough for the free spare OEM battery not to be attractive. This assumes I buy a relatively high-mileage truck and the battery lifespan isn't exceptional.

What do we think will happen to a battery stored on a shelf for 5 years? Any ideas for how to maintain battery health over this period? I'm realizing I may need/want to keep the battery from freezing.

Questions that are maybe more appropriate for the dealership:
Does anyone know if it's possible to test battery health detached from the vehicle? I can call the dealership. No point planning around batteries that are in poor health.

Does anyone know about battery compatibility between model years? One of the batteries has a 2023 stamp with 143.4kWh marked.


Thanks for any advice you're able to share.

Hey @Martin Rebuilds :

This might be something you’ll interested in.

 

[milleniumfalcon]

Thanks for the advice.

I'll look at the home battery options, though I'm worried it will be more of a project than I want to take on right now.

@tearitupsports No, I don't have the charging port. It's just the batteries and some loose connections.

Re: Battery origin, I think we can say they fell off the back of a truck. What I was told is that the police broke up a chop shop, found some batteries, and the batteries went to auction. Someone bought them at auction, tried to figure out how to use them, couldn't find an easy use, tried to sell them on FB Marketplace, then gave them away on FB Marketplace when they wanted the shop space back and thought it was time to move the batteries on. The story seems plausible to me, because I can't see someone with stolen batteries giving them away rather than destroying the evidence. It's a risky move for little personal benefit.

 

[ZSC100]

Martin and I have projects going on with loose packs. I am actively working on a project that uses the on board AC charger and pro power inverter as a home backup that runs during peak cost hours, and charges to 90% during non-peak. The only issue is with using the OEM equipment is that it can't sync to the grid for seamless transfer easily.

Yes, it's absolutely possible to put an ER battery in an SR truck, it's actually fairly easy with FORScan.

So, the smart move here is to, Swap these batteries into trucks for upgrade from SR to ER. People would/should pay around $10k for this.

Then use the batteries for off grid backup.

 

[JMD359]

You may want to consider researching the Nissan Leaf used battery situation. The leaf is an early EV that has a market for batteries and you may find factors that will persuade you to use the packs in other than EV uses now rather then wait for an ER. If EV used battery trends continue the Leaf second use may

 

[JMD359]

The Nissan leaf isn’t a very good example and those batteries were primitive small and air cooled so overheating and lack of thermal management lead to very short battery life , this will not be the case with the lightning at all. There sore demand will be a lot lower for lightning batteries .

 

[Dee]

Based on how you obtained these batteries, since the batteries are probably serialized to the vehicle they came, you may want to check with your local police department to determine if you are in possession of stolen goods. Which may be a crime where you live.

 

[tearitupsports]

Martin and I have projects going on with loose packs. I am actively working on a project that uses the on board AC charger and pro power inverter as a home backup that runs during peak cost hours, and charges to 90% during non-peak. The only issue is with using the OEM equipment is that it can't sync to the grid for seamless transfer easily.

Yes, it's absolutely possible to put an ER battery in an SR truck, it's actually fairly easy with FORScan.

So, the smart move here is to, Swap these batteries into trucks for upgrade from SR to ER. People would/should pay around $10k for this.

Then use the batteries for off grid backup.

If the pack will DC charge correctly through the charge port, we could see if it would work with the Sigenergy V2X charger. That would allow it to go on grid.

 

[ZSC100]

If the pack will DC charge correctly through the charge port, we could see if it would work with the Sigenergy V2X charger. That would allow it to go on grid.

It will work with any charger, but for the OEM BMS to balance the cells it has to be periodically charged with the OEM on board AC charger exclusively.

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