70mph range test in Lightning Pro Standard Battery (State of Charge - Tom)

gorwell · Aug 6, 2022

Came in mostly as expected with 2.2mi/kWh. He ran the extended at the same time and it got 2.1.

Only compliant that happens way too often is that he went on a tangent on how good a value the Pro was but didn't mention you needed to win the lottery to get it. If you watched these reviews of the Pro , you'd think you'd be able to buy one. Great advertising for Ford that they have a 40k truck but only allowed around 3% of customers to order one.

Pioneer74 · Aug 6, 2022

gorwell said:
Great advertising for Ford that they have a 40k truck but only allowed around 3% of customers to order one.

Ford loses money on every Pro they sell. They would go out of business if they didn't restrict them.

gorwell · Aug 6, 2022

Pioneer74 said:
Ford loses money on every Pro they sell. They would go out of business if they didn't restrict them.

Totally fine with them restricting it and it makes sense, but every reviewer makes no mention that it's almost impossible to get as a retail customer.

Yellow Buddy · Aug 6, 2022

gorwell said:
Came in mostly as expected with 2.2mi/kWh. He ran the extended at the same time and it got 2.1.

Only compliant that happens way too often is that he went on a tangent on how good a value the Pro was but didn't mention you needed to win the lottery to get it. If you watched these reviews of the Pro , you'd think you'd be able to buy one. Great advertising for Ford that they have a 40k truck but only allowed around 3% of customers to order one.

Where’s the 3% number from?Ive seen that they’re making as many Pros as platinums.

The 7/11 build week seems to have a good amount of Pros proportionally.

gorwell · Aug 6, 2022

Yellow Buddy said:
Where’s the 3% number from?Ive seen that they’re making as many Pros as platinums.

Ford had an internal document that noted only 3% allocation for Pros.

It sold out in wave one when ford opened up ordering for 1500-2000 people.

I would be surprised if they built more than 400 for MY22 (to retail customers)

LightningShow · Aug 6, 2022

Did anyone notice that the Lariat got much higher efficiency than when Tom ran his full test? They drove 214 miles and the Lariat ER had 30% left. That would extrapolate to 306 miles of range and ~ 2.33mi/kWh.

Yellow Buddy · Aug 6, 2022

gorwell said:
Ford had an internal document that noted only 3% allocation for Pros.

It sold out in wave one when ford opened up ordering for 1500-2000 people.

I would be surprised if they built more than 400 for MY22 (to retail customers)

And to think I almost cancelled my reservation when Wave 1 opened up for me.

shutterbug · Aug 6, 2022

Pioneer74 said:
Ford loses money on every Pro they sell. They would go out of business if they didn't restrict them.

You keep saying that, but Ford executives keep claiming that they are making money on every truck they sell. Are they lying? Or do you have access to some information not available to Ford management?

Also, since you know. How much is Ford losing on every Pro? Is the loss on variable cost, or only if you include fixed cost that Ford incurred before making the first truck?

Regular150 · Aug 6, 2022

We have a Pro in our city, the gentleman eljas a plumbing business. With his business license and the dealership having sold him trucks in the past, he ordered 6/6 and was able to get a Pro. I do think Ford is trying to get all the feedback and usage data from tradesman or companies that use them as a tool. It's the only Lightning I've seen so far around here in the Niceville/Destin panhandle. He's pretty pleased so far and loves the physical controls and of course his fuel bill.

merek · Aug 6, 2022

shutterbug said:
You keep saying that, but Ford executives keep claiming that they are making money on every truck they sell. Are they lying? Or do you have access to some information not available to Ford management?

Also, since you know. How much is Ford losing on every Pro? Is the loss on variable cost, or only if you include fixed cost that Ford incurred before making the first truck?

I suspect that Ford is making a very little amount on each Pro, especially to retail customers. I suspect they are making a little money to fleet customers. They probably wouldn't be making enough money to justify the cost of developing the platform though.

The Pro isn't intended for retail customers, that's why it is not really available. I think they were intending to make 20% Pros though, which are still vehicles going to customers, just not retail customers. People should be grateful they're offering any to retail, they could have easily went fleet-only.

ryan · Aug 6, 2022

LightningShow said:
Did anyone notice that the Lariat got much higher efficiency than when Tom ran his full test? They drove 214 miles and the Lariat ER had 30% left. That would extrapolate to 306 miles of range and ~ 2.33mi/kWh.

Nice sleuthing. Since it's a small bump, it could be wind effect. Lead car breaks the wind, chase car drives through less resistance. Or the lariat rounded up to 30 from 28 (28 would be 2.26). Or the ER has the same reserve kwh as the SR, which means less proportion of the 131kwh is held in reserve and the % drains ever so slightly slower. Or just random noise after a single trial.

kbrannen · Aug 6, 2022

shutterbug said:
You keep saying that, but Ford executives keep claiming that they are making money on every truck they sell. Are they lying? Or do you have access to some information not available to Ford management?

I've heard that Ford loses money on the Pro too and it doesn't makes sense to me either as companies who continually sell products at a loss don't stay in business. OTOH, I heard Jim Farley say in an interview recently (on Munro Live maybe?) that they are making money on the "Lightning line", IIRC, which sounds like he meant across all models together. Which might mean they are barely breaking even on the Pro, but get ahead because of the other models. Also, if they offer "fleet services", perhaps that's where they make it up on the Pro (I don't know what fleet services or management would entail not being in that business but I've heard that exists).

Pioneer74 · Aug 6, 2022

shutterbug said:
You keep saying that, but Ford executives keep claiming that they are making money on every truck they sell. Are they lying? Or do you have access to some information not available to Ford management?

Also, since you know. How much is Ford losing on every Pro? Is the loss on variable cost, or only if you include fixed cost that Ford incurred before making the first truck?

I was at an employee only event and they had "Lightning Specialists" there answering questions. I asked if the Lightning was profitable out of the gate. They said the Pro is a "loss leader" and they hope to turn a profit with the Ford Pro services directed at fleet buyers that purchase them.

And that was before it launched. Look at the inflation in the prices of the battery materials. The Mach-E ER battery was slated to get an increase of $5000 before orders were halted.

personalt · Aug 6, 2022

shutterbug said:
You keep saying that, but Ford executives keep claiming that they are making money on every truck they sell. Are they lying? Or do you have access to some information not available to Ford management?

Also, since you know. How much is Ford losing on every Pro? Is the loss on variable cost, or only if you include fixed cost that Ford incurred before making the first truck?

This theory doesn't make sense if they will make them for fleet sales. But if they make a few bucks or lose a few bucks its still the same that they make more money on the higher trims so the big loss is likely opportunity cost.

monsterlag · Aug 6, 2022

shutterbug said:
You keep saying that, but Ford executives keep claiming that they are making money on every truck they sell. Are they lying? Or do you have access to some information not available to Ford management?

Also, since you know. How much is Ford losing on every Pro? Is the loss on variable cost, or only if you include fixed cost that Ford incurred before making the first truck?

To be fair, there were more than 5 waves of orders exclusive to trims with the highest margins. The lowest margins, Pro and XLT, were taken off very quickly and I am betting will see a substantial price increase for MY23.

70mph range test in Lightning Pro Standard Battery (State of Charge - Tom)

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