FCSP 40 vs 48? Stepwise EV Tap?

[F150Redux]

2025 Lightning Lariat ER

I've read a number of posts regarding charging times 40 vs 48 and it seems like it's 1-1.5 hours difference (from 15-80% in most examples).

I'm on the fence which way to go after having gotten my QMerit Ford Power Promise 2.0 quote.

The selected installer is quoting $1791.25 to install things at 48-amps (60-amp breaker). This is $325 for permitting and $1466.25 for a Stepwise EV Tap (load balancing device). Apparently, his load calculation puts us over the NEC limits.

To install the 40-amp version (50-amp breaker) would be just the $325 permitting fee.

I don't much care about the minimal additional charging time. It seems like very little for almost $1500.00. That would be a bunch of DCFC if needed.

Does anyone have any feedback on the Stepwise EV Tap? It seems strange to me that it doesn't limit the output based on availability but seems to just shut off the tap if the limit is hit.

ETA: I'd really like to have the wiring/etc. installed (correct gauge/etc.) to future proof and allow me to upgrade later if I wanted. But I doubt they'd do that with the Power Promise.

Help me out people? What should I do?

Either way, seems like the installation schedule is two weeks out, so until then I'm stuck with the 120 charging, or paid L2/DCFC stations.

Thanks.

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[Vulnox]

I don't think the extra cost is worth it, and I don't think future proofing applies here.

But you need to say more about yourself to give an answer. For example, we have two EVs, a MachE and a Lightning, but we easily keep both charged just fine with a single ChargePoint 40 Amp EVSE. In fact, I usually have it set to 30 Amp to keep heat down on the connections.

But my wife drives to work each day in the MME and only uses ~10% battery to do so. I work at home except one day a week, and charge at work, so I only need to plug in at home when we do extra driving and take the truck.

In our situation, even at 30 amps, both of our vehicles are always charged and ready to go. It would never even occur to me to care about 48 amps, it would just be cutting time off charging for the sake of saying I can charge faster. The vehicles would just be charged and sitting, so why would I spend $1500 for that?

But that's my situation. Maybe you drive 200 miles every day for work. If so, I could see caring about a 48 amp charger because you probably would be doing a 15-80 charge every day.

Unless you are in that situation though, I would question why you would push for the extra sizing.

As for future proofing as I mentioned earlier, I don't see the "future" benefiting from larger breaker sizing. If anything I suspect we will see battery sizes come down as efficiency improves and auto makers get better at battery sizing. It will surprise me if we see packs larger than 150kWh much beyond what GM is doing right now. I could be wrong, but even if I am, unless you are getting one of those enormous battery vehicles in the future you will still be able to charge at a very good rate for 99.9% of situations.

 

[F150Redux]

I don't think the extra cost is worth it, and I don't think future proofing applies here.

But you need to say more about yourself to give an answer. For example, we have two EVs, a MachE and a Lightning, but we easily keep both charged just fine with a single ChargePoint 40 Amp EVSE. In fact, I usually have it set to 30 Amp to keep heat down on the connections.

But my wife drives to work each day in the MME and only uses ~10% battery to do so. I work at home except one day a week, and charge at work, so I only need to plug in at home when we do extra driving and take the truck.

In our situation, even at 30 amps, both of our vehicles are always charged and ready to go. It would never even occur to me to care about 48 amps, it would just be cutting time off charging for the sake of saying I can charge faster. The vehicles would just be charged and sitting, so why would I spend $1500 for that?

But that's my situation. Maybe you drive 200 miles every day for work. If so, I could see caring about a 48 amp charger because you probably would be doing a 15-80 charge every day.

Unless you are in that situation though, I would question why you would push for the extra sizing.

As for future proofing as I mentioned earlier, I don't see the "future" benefiting from larger breaker sizing. If anything I suspect we will see battery sizes come down as efficiency improves and auto makers get better at battery sizing. It will surprise me if we see packs larger than 150kWh much beyond what GM is doing right now. I could be wrong, but even if I am, unless you are getting one of those enormous battery vehicles in the future you will still be able to charge at a very good rate for 99.9% of situations.

Thanks for the quick response.

I might be wrong, but I think I may have read your thread/response describing your scenario. It sounds familiar, but I have been doing a lot of reading. lol.

Right now, my situation is unemployed/laid off; so that alone should really be enough to just stick with the 40 amp setup. When I was working, I worked remotely from home, so no commute. Ideally, I'm aiming for the same when/if I find my next position.

Even if I get a job with a commute I'm looking into the 60-100 mile round trip range; so it sounds like 40 amp would still be plenty for that.

Any "big" trips we'd either plan for DCFC or just take the wife's gas car.

Part of the hesitation going 48-amp is that I know almost nothing about the Stepwise EV Tap, it's usage/features, etc. If there were some benefits to it than that might swing my decision, but I doubt it.

 

[Maquis]

Go with the “free” version. What is the wiring method? Does the quote spell out wire and raceway (if applicable) size?

 

[F150Redux]

Go with the “free” version. What is the wiring method? Does the quote spell out wire and raceway (if applicable) size?

It's supposed to be conduit, wall mounted (nothing "in" the walls), appropriate gauge wire for the breaker size, etc. They aren't very specific in the quote(s).

For example, the quote just says:


Load Management Device Installation

• Furnish and install one (1) new load management device near electrical panel
• Load management device required due to limited available power (Based on the National Electrical Code - load calculation requirements)
• Load management device will monitor panel usage and allow power to EV charger if available power is present.
• Load management device will prevent the main panel from possible overload

For $1,466.25. It doesn't specify the device make/model or anything. The only reason I know it's Stepwise is because I call the installer and asked a bunch of questions.

They were also trying to charge me another $325 for an additional 10-ft of wiring for no reason. When I asked why and said my install in 30-35 feet max he adjusted the quote and removed that.


Here are the inclusions/exclusions. I think these were posted elsewhere:


Inclusions
Standard installation will include:

• Provide and install externally mounted, electrical code-compliant wiring and conduit, maximum 50 ft.
• Provide and install a properly sized breaker, maximum 60 amps.
• Main Panel load calculation.
• Charger hardwiring, mounting, testing, and commissioning.
• Installation by a Qmerit Certified Installer. All Qmerit Certified Installers are licensed, background checked, and trained on the latest home electrification technologies.

Exclusions
Standard Installation will exclude:

• Installation of Charging Hardware at an apartment or multi-family building or any residence without a dedicated electrical meter
• Electrical service infrastructure upgrades including, but not limited to, main panel/subpanel upgrades or additions, load management devices, a main service disconnect, or whole home surge protection
• 240v Electrical Outlets
• GFCI Breakers or other breakers not dedicated to the new EV charger circuit including quad and tandem breakers
• Trenching
• Installations of new circuits greater than 60 amps or that exceed 50ft
• Installation of electrical wiring that is routed through or concealed within walls, ceilings, or other spaces with restricted access.
• Breakers not dedicated to the new EV charger circuit including quad and tandem breakers.
• Drywall, stucco, plaster, concrete or any other repairs to walls, ceilings or floors as a result of penetration for wiring purposes.
• Level 2 charging or electrical upgrade permitting fees including fees by authority having jurisdiction (AHJ) and any additional costs for necessary engineering, inspections, and administration.

 

[Maquis]

It's supposed to be conduit, wall mounted (nothing "in" the walls), appropriate gauge wire for the breaker size, etc. They aren't very specific in the quote(s).

For example, the quote just says:


Load Management Device Installation

• Furnish and install one (1) new load management device near electrical panel
• Load management device required due to limited available power (Based on the National Electrical Code - load calculation requirements)
• Load management device will monitor panel usage and allow power to EV charger if available power is present.
• Load management device will prevent the main panel from possible overload

For $1,466.25. It doesn't specify the device make/model or anything. The only reason I know it's Stepwise is because I call the installer and asked a bunch of questions.

They were also trying to charge me another $325 for an additional 10-ft of wiring for no reason. When I asked why and said my install in 30-35 feet max he adjusted the quote and removed that.


Here are the inclusions/exclusions. I think these were posted elsewhere:


Inclusions
Standard installation will include:

• Provide and install externally mounted, electrical code-compliant wiring and conduit, maximum 50 ft.
• Provide and install a properly sized breaker, maximum 60 amps.
• Main Panel load calculation.
• Charger hardwiring, mounting, testing, and commissioning.
• Installation by a Qmerit Certified Installer. All Qmerit Certified Installers are licensed, background checked, and trained on the latest home electrification technologies.

Exclusions
Standard Installation will exclude:

• Installation of Charging Hardware at an apartment or multi-family building or any residence without a dedicated electrical meter
• Electrical service infrastructure upgrades including, but not limited to, main panel/subpanel upgrades or additions, load management devices, a main service disconnect, or whole home surge protection
• 240v Electrical Outlets
• GFCI Breakers or other breakers not dedicated to the new EV charger circuit including quad and tandem breakers
• Trenching
• Installations of new circuits greater than 60 amps or that exceed 50ft
• Installation of electrical wiring that is routed through or concealed within walls, ceilings, or other spaces with restricted access.
• Breakers not dedicated to the new EV charger circuit including quad and tandem breakers.
• Drywall, stucco, plaster, concrete or any other repairs to walls, ceilings or floors as a result of penetration for wiring purposes.
• Level 2 charging or electrical upgrade permitting fees including fees by authority having jurisdiction (AHJ) and any additional costs for necessary engineering, inspections, and administration.

Yeah, tell him the allowance is for the materials for a 60A branch circuit and install everything to handle 60A except for a 50A breaker. That eliminates the need for any load management device.

 

[F150Redux]

Yeah, tell him the allowance is for the materials for a 60A branch circuit and install everything to handle 60A except for a 50A breaker. That eliminates the need for any load management device.

I'm going to call tomorrow and see if they'd do that. I'm guessing the answer would be no.

I'm sure they've seen people request that, and then as soon as the inspection/etc. is over they swap out the 50 amp breaker for a 60 amp, and then change the setting in the FCSP. (Not like I thought of doing that... I'm a good boy and wouldn't violate the code).

 

[F150Redux]

One more wrinkle. Looks like I could also qualify for the Federal "Alternative Fuel Vehicle Refueling Property Credit" and get a $573.38 credit at tax time. Need to look into this more.

@TaxmanHog Any input on this? (Time to search the forums)

 

[Maquis]

One more wrinkle. Looks like I could also qualify for the Federal "Alternative Fuel Vehicle Refueling Property Credit" and get a $573.38 credit at tax time. Need to look into this more.

@TaxmanHog Any input on this? (Time to search the forums)

The credit now depends on you living in a “disadvantaged area.”

 

[F150Redux]

The credit now depends on you living in a “disadvantaged area.”

I saw that, looked up the GEOID for my location, and then checked the PDF they linked to. It showed up. Figured that meant I was eligible. Guess I need to investigate more tonight.

ETA: My area is in a "2020 non-urban census tracts".

Per the IRS notes I should qualify:

" To qualify, the refueling or recharging property must be installed in a low-income community census tract or non-urban census tract. "

https://www.irs.gov/credits-deducti...cle-refueling-property-credit-for-individuals

 

[RickLightning]

The credit now depends on you living in a “disadvantaged area.”

My neighborhood of large homes qualifies....

I've read a number of posts regarding charging times 40 vs 48 and it seems like it's 1-1.5 hours difference (from 15-80% in most examples).

48/40 = 20% faster.

131kWh battery. 15 to 80% is 65%, or 85kWh.

48amps is about 10.5kW, 40 is about 8.6.

85/10.5=8.1 hours
85/8.6=9.9 hours

Is it worth it to save 1.8 hours? When will that matter to you?

 

[bmwhitetx]

I agree with @Maquis. I would push to get the installed wire capable of 60 amps and do a 50 amp breaker. Perfectly legal and if you upgrade your panel in the future you could install a 60-amp.

Sounds like they are using conduit so that would be THHN #6 wire instead of #8.

Also on the charger install credit, I didn’t get it at tax time because of credit limits when combined with the $7500 federal credit and the Alternative Minimum Tax. If you got the point of sale credit, I don’t know if it still applies. Many of us got hit with that in 2022. Of course you tax situation is different- so just a heads up.

 

[pullinggs]

I've read a number of posts regarding charging times 40 vs 48 and it seems like it's 1-1.5 hours difference (from 15-80% in most examples).

FWIW, I could charge at 48A but I've got the EVSE set to 24A. Everything stays cooler and the truck is still ready before I am in the morning. (Admittedly, I'm usually only charging from about 40% to 80%, but do you really expect to use 85 kWh every day?) Unless your use case requires the fastest charge rate possible, even 40A is probably overkill.

 

[TaxmanHog]

I saw that, looked up the GEOID for my location, and then checked the PDF they linked to. It showed up. Figured that meant I was eligible.

Good to go then!

 

[F150Redux]

Just talked to the QMerit Installer again. He's going to update the quote (if he even needs to) to install the wiring for the 48/60 configuration but will install the 50 amp breaker and set the EVSE to 40 amp.

I confirmed that he'd be doing conduit and the THHN #6 wire.

I'm guessing the quote now will just be for the permitting fee but won't know until later today (he was out at an installation).

Thanks all for the input/advice!

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