FCSP or Another Level 2 Charger?

[Avalanche]

Hi all, I will be taking delivery of a Lightning ER on Friday and I'm looking for information regarding the Level 2 charger. I have two options under consideration. What would you do?

Option 1: Install the FCSP. This requires a significant transformer upgrade from my utility, so while the charger is free with the truck, there is some additional cost but the utility hasn't told me how much exactly (and can't until they have one available.)

Option 2: Install a ChargePoint 40A charger provided by my utility company. It's also provided free, but I pay for the installation. I could DIY it (yes, I'm capable) but if I hire an electrician and let the utility connect to their PowerShift program (i.e. charging when not in peak load times) I would get a $500 rebate from the state. If I chose this, I would still have the FCSP sent to me. This would also require a transformer upgrade but to a smaller transformer (less money).

Option 3: Have the utility upgrade to the larger transformer, but install the ChargePoint charger. This way I have a bigger buffer for future electrical expansion or to install the FCSP at a later time if I want faster charging. I could change out chargers anytime after I get the $500 rebate.

I believe the FCSP is the faster charger, but is that really necessary? Would a 40A charger take my ER battery from low to full overnight even in cold Vermont winter? Are there user interface reasons to stick with the Ford charger? FWIW, this is our first EV and likely the only EV we will have for several more years at least.

Thanks for any insight and opinions you can provide!

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[TaxmanHog]

Hi all, I will be taking delivery of a Lightning ER on Friday and I'm looking for information regarding the Level 2 charger. I have two options under consideration. What would you do?

Option 1: Install the FCSP. This requires a significant transformer upgrade from my utility, so while the charger is free with the truck, there is some additional cost but the utility hasn't told me how much exactly (and can't until they have one available.)

Option 2: Install a ChargePoint 40A charger provided by my utility company. It's also provided free, but I pay for the installation. I could DIY it (yes, I'm capable) but if I hire an electrician and let the utility connect to their PowerShift program (i.e. charging when not in peak load times) I would get a $500 rebate from the state. If I chose this, I would still have the FCSP sent to me. This would also require a transformer upgrade but to a smaller transformer (less money).

Option 3: Have the utility upgrade to the larger transformer, but install the ChargePoint charger. This way I have a bigger buffer for future electrical expansion or to install the FCSP at a later time if I want faster charging. I could change out chargers anytime after I get the $500 rebate.

I believe the FCSP is the faster charger, but is that really necessary? Would a 40A charger take my ER battery from low to full overnight even in cold Vermont winter? Are there user interface reasons to stick with the Ford charger? FWIW, this is our first EV and likely the only EV we will have for several more years at least.

Thanks for any insight and opinions you can provide!

~13 to 15 hours 0 to 100% at 40 amps, would you actually get as low as 0% in the course of a drive-day?

How many miles in a day would you be driving?

Worst case winter range being ~250 miles due to cold.

 

[brewski]

You don't *have* to have your electrical upgraded.
You can dial down the FCSP.
I have my (48amp) charger set to charge between 11pm to 7am.
Yesterday my SOC was about 30%.
I plugged it in about 9:30 and it started right away.
It finished about 7am.
Normally plugging in every few days that 11-7 time frame is a non-issue.

 

[Zprime29]

The FCSP is only really needed if one plans to install the home integration system (the automatic backup) which is quite expensive and a little buggy right now. 40A charging is perfectly reasonable for typical daily use. I installed the FCSP mostly because I could without needing an upgrade. Since you need an upgrade either way, maybe consider option 3 but sell the FCSP to help offset the cost. There will be better chargers that can pull 80A in the future if you decide at that time to go bigger.

 

[Avalanche]

~13 to 15 hours 0 to 100% at 40 amps, would you actually get as low as 0% in the course of a drive-day?

How many miles in a day would you be driving?

Worst case winter range being ~250 miles due to cold.

Thanks, the charge time is really helpful to know. I highly doubt I'd be anywhere near zero at the end of a typical day. I've been putting 8-10k miles/year on my old Toyota Sequoia, mostly 4mi, 15mi, and 25-30mi round trips depending on how big of a town I need to go to.

 

[Avalanche]

You don't *have* to have your electrical upgraded.
You can dial down the FCSP.
I have my (48amp) charger set to charge between 11pm to 7am.
Yesterday my SOC was about 30%.
I plugged it in about 9:30 and it started right away.
It finished about 7am.
Normally plugging in every few days that 11-7 time frame is a non-issue.

Thanks, good info. My utility will only give the smaller charger provided it's installed by a licensed electrician and they "right size" the transformer to the max. But I get what you're saying. In reality, I'll probably be setting mine to charge when the sun's shining. We have a PV system and it's cheapest to use electricity while the panels are making it. That way it would never put a load on the transformer.

 

[Avalanche]

The FCSP is only really needed if one plans to install the home integration system (the automatic backup) which is quite expensive and a little buggy right now. 40A charging is perfectly reasonable for typical daily use. I installed the FCSP mostly because I could without needing an upgrade. Since you need an upgrade either way, maybe consider option 3 but sell the FCSP to help offset the cost. There will be better chargers that can pull 80A in the future if you decide at that time to go bigger.

I'm thinking that this is the best way to go. I had to pay to upgrade the transformer in 2018 with the PV installation, but we didn't know at the time we'd be needing even more. I'll kick myself if I need to upgrade that thing three times!

 

[hturnerfamily]

Everyone has a different lifestyle and use case, but I have yet to see any value for me to have a 'hard-wired' EVSE of any sort. My wife's PHEV uses a simple 240v 16a mobile charger for everyday at-home charging, and my LIGHTNING uses the FordMobileCharger EVSE for it's at-home everyday charging - I take it with me when I travel with my Camper, as a second option for my 'mobile' MaxGreen adjustable 240v 10-30amp EVSE, which can only use 240v power.
The FordMobileCharger can use 120v, too, so it's the 'emergency' equipment, and has come in handy at campgrounds with only 30/20amp 120v power available.

I simply unplug my EVSE and take it with me on longer trips where a charging stop will be in the future, especially when towing the camper... DC Fast Charging is usually in the cards, but, in today's EV charging infrastructure, where RELIABILITY can be an issue, it gives me a 'backup' to my 'other' backup. : ) Most people might be quite surprised by the number of charging outlet options you have in any specific area - whether a simple houshold 120v outlet, or businesses that now offer a NEMA 14-50 outlet, such as many LITTLE CEASARS pizza shops. Campgrounds and RV parks are another 240v option, and PLUGSHARE, as an independent app for feedback on charging options from EV owners, is a terrific place to help 'locate' a charge option you might have never considered.

I also see little value, for me, for anything that 'has' to be faster than the 7.2kwh that the FordMobileCharger or my other 240v EVSE can provide, AND it means that you only need to access the 240v power in your home that you already have.

 

[RickLightning]

One of the things that constantly gets left out of the "how much power" discussions is MONEY.

ERs get the Ford Charge Station Pro FREE. Yes, you can sell it (I did). Most seem to be priced around $500 - $800. I got $1,000.

The Ford Charge Station Pro isn't a line item, so you can't take a tax credit on it to my understanding.

My utility pays me $500 rebate on a purchased EVSE. Does NOT have to be installed by an electrician.

There is a 30% tax credit, up to $1,000 (meaning spending up to $3,333.33) for EVSE and installation.

So, let's do my math:

$608.44 for JB 48 with tax
$ 27.10 for two 3 port connectors to replace my two 2 port connectors
($500.00) Utility company rebate
=======
$135.54 spending to get a 2nd charger
($40.66) 30% tax credit
=======
$94.88 net cost
($1,000.00) sold Ford Charge Station Pro
=======
$905.12 net profit

 

[Grease Lightning]

Thanks, the charge time is really helpful to know. I highly doubt I'd be anywhere near zero at the end of a typical day. I've been putting 8-10k miles/year on my old Toyota Sequoia, mostly 4mi, 15mi, and 25-30mi round trips depending on how big of a town I need to go to.

Also keep in mind that the miles are only one part. The second is how much recovery time you need. I drive a lot on the weekends, but not much week days. So I need to look at how quick I need to get back to 80-90% state of charge. While I was contemplating the same exact question, I have charged my Lightning on 16 amp 240v exclusively for the last 6 weeks and in most cases it worked fine. The one time it didn’t, I put 60 kW in on a fast charge and went my merry way.

Unless you are doing a turn and burn adventure 40-48 amps will generally be enough.

My ChargePoint charger shows up next week through a huge discount purchase program with my utility. I wish Ford had a return policy on just the FCSP.

 

[Danface]

Thanks, the charge time is really helpful to know. I highly doubt I'd be anywhere near zero at the end of a typical day. I've been putting 8-10k miles/year on my old Toyota Sequoia, mostly 4mi, 15mi, and 25-30mi round trips depending on how big of a town I need to go to.

 

[Danface]

I have the Non-Ford branded 48Amp charger (Made by LiteOn) and I believe it's switchable from 48 Amp to 80 Amps

https://www.ebay.com/itm/404383430943
https://content.fordpro.com/content...Ford-Pro-User-and-Installation-Manual-48A.pdf

I'll go look in at it now in the garage now to confirm and if you need a 48 amp charger that may well be switchable to 80 amps, let me know, I'm in Massachusetts.

I have another 80 Pro Chrger for home and was going to use the one above at our place in Maine.

I mention because if the unit I have would work for you, I'd be happy to work out a deal and would also be ammenable to taking it back if "something was outta whack" so to speak.

If it can be switched between 48 and 80, you could just decide later

MANUAL:
https://inchargeus.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/inCharge-spec-sheet-LiteOn-80A-221130.pdf

LITEON
https://www.liteon.com/en-us/product/432

The instructions show that the output is selectable (see photo)

 

[Adventureboy]

As many have said, it depends on how you will use the truck. If you plan on rolling in at 11pm in single-digit SOC regularly and need to be fully charged by 7am, the FCSP will do this. It sounds more like you are a normal driver who won't put 200-300 miles a day on the truck and a normal 40A charger will work perfectly.

I actually have a dual charger on a 50A circuit that allows me to charge both the Lightning and my wife's MME. If only one is plugged in, it gives the full 40A to that vehicle. If both are plugged in and charging, it splits 20A-20A. If one is done charging, it provides 32A to the charging EV and 8A to the other to maintain. Works really well for the driving we do. (about 20k miles/year on the Lightning and 14k /year on the MME).

As for the transformer upgrade, it seems they are milking you. I'd ask them to update the transformer to support the FCSP. This gives you options when the second EV comes along (and it probably will). In the meantime, given your driving, a single 40A EVSE should do you well.

For context, I have a Lariat ER in Canada just west of you north of Toronto. Plan on 15-20% reduction in range in the cold winter. Set departure times in the winter. It will improve your range since it conditions the battery on the EVSE before you leave.

Enjoy the Lightning - It is an awesome truck.

 

[ridgebackpilot]

Your Option 2 is best. As others have pointed out, you don’t really need the FCSP. We charge our Lightning Lariat ER all the time with our Level 2 charger. Works fine overnight and I’ve never needed more.

Before you decide, you might want to price the utility upgrade. To get the most out of your FCSP, you’d have to upgrade your charging circuit to at least 100 amps (to allow continuous load charging of 80 amps). That can get expensive, especially with some utilities!

 

[Avalanche]

Thanks all for the information. It's super helpful. I've decided to go with the 40amp charger provided by my utility company. They can't upgrade the transformer until March or so. Until then I'll mostly be using a mobile charger and/or the public charger at the library a mile down the road. After the system is setup, I'll likely sell the FCSP to recoup some money.

For those interested in knowing, the utility told me that at today's prices, an upgrade to a 37.5kva transformer is $1800 and a 50kva transformer is $5000. We're at the end of a 1500' driveway and the transformer is on the last pole about 300' from our house. We're the only ones serviced by this unit. The utility is a small coop, which they tout as a great thing. However, it's the only coop I've ever joined unwillingly. To be fair, they make it pretty clear that "members" are responsible for upgrades if they need to happen. I just wish they/we had a little more foresight in 2018 when we upgraded the transformer for our PV system.

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