CHARGING IN THE WINTER

[sotek2345]

On the topic of winter charging, I forgot what the verdict was on how low the temp has to be for plugging in to make sense, to keep the battery warm enough for longevity. We dipped just bellow freezing recently and I had it plugged in because I thought I read somewhere that threshold temp for heating the battery is different when you are plugged in vs when you are not. I didn’t see any energy going in while it was plugged in. Maybe battery temp never went bellow freezing while it was bellow zero outside.

I don’t want to plug in when it does not make any difference. I am sure this was discussed here before but I ran out of patience with search. Anyone remembers or have experimented with this? At what temp battery heater kicks in? And is it different when plugged in?

I recall that thread and the verdict was ~50F. That said, I don't usually plug every night until it gets below freezing.

On the main subject - upstate NY and no garage so all charging is outside. No real issues with either the Ford Pro or Grizzl-e L2 chargers freezing over the last several years. Might just be an Emporia issue

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[RickLightning]

On the topic of winter charging, I forgot what the verdict was on how low the temp has to be for plugging in to make sense, to keep the battery warm enough for longevity. We dipped just bellow freezing recently and I had it plugged in because I thought I read somewhere that threshold temp for heating the battery is different when you are plugged in vs when you are not. I didn’t see any energy going in while it was plugged in. Maybe battery temp never went bellow freezing while it was bellow zero outside.

I don’t want to plug in when it does not make any difference. I am sure this was discussed here before but I ran out of patience with search. Anyone remembers or have experimented with this? At what temp battery heater kicks in? And is it different when plugged in?

When the truck us unplugged, it will do nothing to keep the battery warm. Nothing.

I recall that thread and the verdict was ~50F. That said, I don't usually plug every night until it gets below freezing.

On the main subject - upstate NY and no garage so all charging is outside. No real issues with either the Ford Pro or Grizzl-e L2 chargers freezing over the last several years. Might just be an Emporia issue

If you have the truck plugged in, when it determines that the battery would benefit from warming, it will pull current for a short period. This occurs near freezing, not 50 degrees. When I had a charger app that worked, for the Mach-E, parked in my garage (unheated, but part of house), it happened a handful of times for 20 min spurts across a winter.

This morning is was minus 3F. Car is currently 36F at the ceiling. Car is plugged in, truck is not, and car did not pull current last night.

I will be monitoring this winter on both and note when/if it happens. I do prevent this from happening between 11AM and 7PM, our peak rate period.

 

[bc1]

Is this freezing being discussed considered 32 degrees F or Zero degrees F? Right now we are going down below water freezing temp every night so I would need to plug it in all the time. Kansas doesn't see the below zero F until some severe artic cold fronts start rolling in and hopefully not till Jan or Feb.

That said, some days I may only drive 30 to 40 miles and use 10 to 15% so I am under the impression not to charge it until I've run it down somewhere under 50% or if I have a longer trip planned the next day. Any thoughts here? Can I plug it in without pushing the button so it doesn't start the charge?

 

[PJnc284]

Those batteries seem to hold heat pretty well unless it's bone chilling cold. It was about 25F one morning this week and the min battery temp showing in car scanner was still about 40F. Supposed to be in the teens-20's Monday night here so will have to see what the temps are then.

 

[RickLightning]

Is this freezing being discussed considered 32 degrees F or Zero degrees F? Right now we are going down below water freezing temp every night so I would need to plug it in all the time. Kansas doesn't see the below zero F until some severe artic cold fronts start rolling in and hopefully not till Jan or Feb.

That said, some days I may only drive 30 to 40 miles and use 10 to 15% so I am under the impression not to charge it until I've run it down somewhere under 50% or if I have a longer trip planned the next day. Any thoughts here? Can I plug it in without pushing the button so it doesn't start the charge?

Freezing is 32F.

No, you do not NEED to plug it in just because because the temp will be below 32F.

Don't know where you got that impression from, but it wasn't the manual. You should plug in every night, and charge to 90%, as the manual recommends.

There is no "pushing the button". You plug in and it starts charging unless you have set charging hours, in which case it starts then. What button are you talking about?

 

[Athrun88]

Is this freezing being discussed considered 32 degrees F or Zero degrees F? Right now we are going down below water freezing temp every night so I would need to plug it in all the time. Kansas doesn't see the below zero F until some severe artic cold fronts start rolling in and hopefully not till Jan or Feb.

That said, some days I may only drive 30 to 40 miles and use 10 to 15% so I am under the impression not to charge it until I've run it down somewhere under 50% or if I have a longer trip planned the next day. Any thoughts here? Can I plug it in without pushing the button so it doesn't start the charge?

ABC - Always Be Charging

I plug in at home every chance I get. Charge limit is to 90% per the manual (which is actually closer to 82% in reality based on how Ford has designed things) and the truck preconditions every morning regardless of whether I'm heading out or not because I have an irratic driving schedule. If I have to head out, then I just head out. The battery will do what it needs to do to warm/cool things down as needed.

 

[Heliian]

Maybe battery temp never went bellow freezing while it was bellow zero outside.

The battery conditioning maintains a set minimum temp when plugged in to level 2. I find it active below 10 degC and works more the colder it gets.

hold heat pretty well unless

There is wind. Nothing draws the heat out faster than a cold breeze, even at less than freezing temps.

It was about - 14 degC yesterday and the truck gives a prompt to plug in to maintain battery temp.

My off peak is 7pm-7am weekdays, I don't plug it in until 7pm as it will still draw power for heating outside the time windows.

 

[PJnc284]

The battery conditioning maintains a set minimum temp when plugged in to level 2. I find it active below 10 degC and works more the colder it gets.

There is wind. Nothing draws the heat out faster than a cold breeze, even at less than freezing temps.

It was about - 14 degC yesterday and the truck gives a prompt to plug in to maintain battery temp.

My off peak is 7pm-7am weekdays, I don't plug it in until 7pm as it will still draw power for heating outside the time windows.

I'd be begging for heat too.

 

[Maxx]

The battery conditioning maintains a set minimum temp when plugged in to level 2. I find it active below 10 degC and works more the colder it gets.

If that is the case, it must be doing it by engaging HVB regardless of being plugged in or not because I didn’t see anything going in from my chargers while plugged in. Has anyone seen this happening by monitoring OBD-II ?

 

[RickLightning]

If that is the case, it must be doing it by engaging HVB regardless of being plugged in or not because I didn’t see anything going in from my chargers while plugged in. Has anyone seen this happening by monitoring OBD-II ?

No. It doesn't happen at 50 degrees, or near it, as I said. I don't know where Heliian comes up with that number.

 

[PJnc284]

I've only noticed it when it was in the teens and had been cold for a while (hard to get in NC with the bipolar weather we have). @TaxmanHog didn't you look into this a while back and provide a bunch of nerd data or am I imagining things.

 

[bc1]

The button is inside the charge door to the right of the receptacle. The manual says to push and hold the button in just before plugging in the charger when a series of lights around the button light up and turn blue showing the rate of charge I believe. It says to push and hold the button in when unplugging the charger as well. Guess I'll try it tonight without pushing the button and see if it automatically starts charging or not.

Guess I've read stuff on the interweb about lithium battery long term life cycle that says they need to be regularly run down a ways before charging or they may get a memory or else just won't last as long, etc. if you just for example run it down to 80% every day and recharged it. Mine is still new at 4100 miles and just over 2 months old. I also realize cold weather has an affect on the batteries and if I had bot it in the spring I would have been able to break the battery in assuming it has a break in period.

I got days where I drive 30 to 70 miles and can go 2 or 3 days before charging and let it go down. But if I need to go to Wichita or some other longer trip then I want it starting at 100% cause who knows where I may end up out in the sticks in Kansas with no chargers around. Already done one of those limp into town on the back roads at 35 mph at 2, then 1, then 0% till I got to a charger hoping it didn't die on a busy street where I couldn't pull over. Don't need that again.

 

[TaxmanHog]

I don’t want to plug in when it does not make any difference. I am sure this was discussed here before but I ran out of patience with search. Anyone remembers or have experimented with this? At what temp battery heater kicks in? And is it different when plugged in?

I've only noticed it when it was in the teens and had been cold for a while (hard to get in NC with the bipolar weather we have). @TaxmanHog didn't you look into this a while back and provide a bunch of nerd data or am I imagining things.

Yes, I've nerded out on this concern in older threads.

Interestingly, this morning was my first observation of the pop up message to plug in to help optimize battery performance (paraphrased).

I generally don't worry about always be charging {ABC} most of the time because 95% of our trips are short haul, time & miles, so I don't need 100% output performance to the motors or enough reserve SOC to complete my daily nevermind weekly travel requirements, but that's me, YMMV, especially long distance daily commuters, if that's you ..... you need to be ABC.

So, this morning our lowest temperature was 11°, prior to this we had 40, 30 and a few high 20's, but Silver Lightning wasn't happy about that eleven degrees, she showed available energy to the motors limited to 95% with a HVB SOC of 72%, when I arrived at our favorite breakfast spot, placed truck in park, I got the cautionary reminder to plug in when possible.

If I were to plug in, the HVB thermal management system & BMS would kick on a short heating cycle to take the edge off the cold soaked condition of the battery, once it get's to that minimum acceptable level the PTC & circulators stop, the added heat typically amounts to 2 to 6 kWH of energy, not a huge amount, but in my use case a waste of energy, hence why I don't bother.

Saturday evening I'll plug in for the weekly charging back to 90%, when I do the PTC and circulator will kick in and bring up the battery temp a little while the charging commences, once the charging is done, the additional heat will hold for a couple of days depending on outside conditions, note that I charge inside a unheated garage, so still susceptible to cold soak but no wind chill impact.

 

[Maxx]

If I were to plug in, the HVB thermal management system & BMS would kick on a short heating cycle to take the edge off the cold soaked condition of the battery, once it get's to that minimum acceptable level the PTC & circulators stop

Have you ever checked the battery temp with the car scanner to see what that minimum is?

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