Footprint of 131Kwh battery vs 98 kw battery

[chl]

Has anyone noticed more failures of Lightning batteries in ER's vs SR's?

I haven't done a count but my impression has been that the lightning battery failures posted on the forum(s) have mostly been of ER trims?

It seems the NHTSA 25s18 recall affected both ER and SR batteries however so maybe my impression is wrong?

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[P-38]

I wonder about putting more cells in the same space though regarding longevity and reliability.

Need good heat management - for dissipation and thermal expansion which could be more of a challenge with the higher density batteries.

Heat is a major factor in battery longevity so thermal management is critical.

Also charging rate has to be faster (higher current) to get to the same charge level in the same time as a less densely packed battery.

Has anyone noticed more failures of Lightning batteries in ER's vs SR's?

I think @GoodSam has a tracking sheet in his signature for battery or power train failures. You could look at that data for ER vs. SR or even large module vs small module (just normalize for fewer large modules in ER vs. SR having all 9 small)

 

[bmwhitetx]

I wonder about putting more cells in the same space though regarding longevity and reliability.

Need good heat management - for dissipation and thermal expansion which could be more of a challenge with the higher density batteries.

Heat is a major factor in battery longevity so thermal management is critical.

Also charging rate has to be faster (higher current) to get to the same charge level in the same time as a less densely packed battery.

Has anyone noticed more failures of Lightning batteries in ER's vs SR's?

Some good points. I know when I had a module fail on my '22 two years ago it seemed like all the others were '22 Lariats also. Of course in '22 Ford really pushed the Lariat and Platinum - and limited the XLT and Pro (to the point reservation holders had to wait until 2023). So there are a whole lot more ER modules -at least for 2022.

 

[chl]

Some good points. I know when I had a module fail on my '22 two years ago it seemed like all the others were '22 Lariats also. Of course in '22 Ford really pushed the Lariat and Platinum - and limited the XLT and Pro (to the point reservation holders had to wait until 2023). So there are a whole lot more ER modules -at least for 2022.

Well some time down the line it should show up in the data if it is an issue.

Yes, I wanted a Pro and could not find a '22, the '23's Pro were also hard to come by until the end of the year when I finally started to see more availability - bought my Pro in Jan 2024 so I could get the tax credit up front.

A lot of the local dealerships were putting a hefty premium on the available '22 trims of up to $10k.
Even the '23's had premiums from some dealerships.
Then the demand collapsed, big surprise, and the asking price came back down to earth.

 

[Tom M]

Thanks, nice chart. I didn't know what the "buffer" capacity was.

I suppose the difference between 123kWh and 142.1kWh is the "buffer" extra battery capacity for health so the battery does not get too close to actual 100% or actual 0% controlled by the BMS (battery management system).

Sort of like gross and net income. The "usable" capacity is the net.

PS: AI had told me this but hadn't seen it in writing from Ford.

"The F-150 Lightning Extended Range has a total battery capacity of approximately 146-148 kWh, with a net usable capacity of 131 kWh"

My 2022 Lariat ER has a sticker on the battery just below the drivers door. It says 143.3 kWh. Sorry for the photo quality, it’s really hard to take pictures in that location.

 

[chl]

My 2022 Lariat ER has a sticker on the battery just below the drivers door. It says 143.3 kWh. Sorry for the photo quality, it’s really hard to take pictures in that location.

Thanks, now I'll have to look for my sticker!

 

[blueI5land]

and how about the weight? is it the exact same for 98kw and 131kw?

 

[TaxmanHog]

and how about the weight? is it the exact same for 98kw and 131kw?

No, the SR pack equipped trucks have a lower curb weight.

Part of the difference includes less auxiliary equipment, namely one board charger on all SR's across the years vs the Lightning ER's that had two in the 22's & 23's.

 

[blueI5land]

lol. impossible to get a straight answer here.

Forcing me to ask questions in a brutally direct way:

Question 1: what is the weight of the 131kw battery pack?

Question 2: what is the weight of the 98kw battery pack?

 

[The Weatherman]

lol. impossible to get a straight answer here.

Forcing me to ask questions in a brutally direct way:

Question 1: what is the weight of the 131kw battery pack?

Question 2: what is the weight of the 98kw battery pack?

Approximately:

2. 1,800 lbs

1. 2,100 lbs

 

[PreservedSwine]

and how about the weight? is it the exact same for 98kw and 131kw?

Did you see the thread where a member just swapped his SR for an ER battery he bought on eBay? Perfect fit. He didn't even need to program the truck- it recognized and added the appropriate kWh'rs to his range.

 

[chl]

Did you see the thread where a member just swapped his SR for an ER battery he bought on eBay? Perfect fit. He didn't even need to program the truck- it recognized and added the appropriate kWh'rs to his range.

Yes, but I wonder about the on-board chargers - did he add the second one that ER models have or did he just stick with the one charger the SRs have? If the latter, charging cannot go to 80A with AC charging at home L2.

 

[PJnc284]

Yes, but I wonder about the on-board chargers - did he add the second one that ER models have or did he just stick with the one charger the SRs have? If the latter, charging cannot go to 80A with AC charging at home L2.

Believe the battery was the only thing he added. Not really any different than probably 99.9% of 24/25 ERs though.

 

[PreservedSwine]

Yes, but I wonder about the on-board chargers - did he add the second one that ER models have or did he just stick with the one charger the SRs have? If the latter, charging cannot go to 80A with AC charging at home L2.

No, he didn't. As I understand it, the dual onboard chargers were just for a couple years, and just A/C. So it would only affect 80 Amp Ford CSP units on model year 2023 and 2022. Which if we're being honest, loosing the 80Amp Ford CSP isn't a big loss

not entirely sure about the DC Fast charging.

 

[chl]

No, he didn't. As I understand it, the dual onboard chargers were just for a couple years, and just A/C. So it would only affect 80 Amp Ford CSP units on model year 2023 and 2022. Which if we're being honest, loosing the 80Amp Ford CSP isn't a big loss

not entirely sure about the DC Fast charging.

He put an old ER battery in as I recall to an SR truck.

All trucks with the ER batteries had dual chargers so one could charge to 100% in a reasonable amount of time at 80A (19.2kW= 240V x 80A).

Then the Flash sized battery (123kWh) came along with only 1 charger, the same charger as on the SR trucks with a 48A max current (11.52kW = 48A x 240V).

So either he has an ER battery with just one 48A limited charger, or he also put in the second charger, the video did not specify unless I missed it.

240V x 48A x time = 131kWh (full battery capacity - usable - of the ER) so
11.37 hours to fully charge with a 48A limited L2 charger.

It'd be about 6.82 hours at 80A with 2 on-board chargers.

Ignoring losses of course in both scenarios and using nominal voltage of 240VAC.

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