New Lightning owner puzzled at the slow AC charge

[WEC]

I have a 25 Flash (a little bit smaller battery), but charges steadily at 10.4 kW all night on my Ford Charge Station Pro. I'm wondering if you have a loose connection or some overheating issue caused by some loose of defective part in the onboard AC charger. If you can find another level 2 charger to test on would rule out your Autel.

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[RocketGhost]

My Emporia charger would throttle the output (rather erratically) when it would overheat due to 90F+ in my garage. It probably should handle it, but it was motivation to install A/C in my garage I had wanted to do anyway. Problem solved. My point is that the charger does have the capability to throttle the speed during a charge.

Now that doesn't explain why you don't have throttling with your BMW.

My advice is to find a 48a Level 2 charger somewhere and see what happens. See what you can find on Plugshare. That will tell you if it's the truck or your charger.

 

[Northcaptain]

Forget your 8kw. You're paying. 4.7 cents a kwh. Im at 27 cents. What cost you 3.03 for 63.6 kwh would cost me $17.17.

Yes, my 40 amp charger is running at 39.6 amps.

Rick

Yes electricity is cheap in Quebec but you have to endure -20F for 4 months LOL

 

[Northcaptain]

My Emporia charger would throttle the output (rather erratically) when it would overheat due to 90F+ in my garage. It probably should handle it, but it was motivation to install A/C in my garage I had wanted to do anyway. Problem solved. My point is that the charger does have the capability to throttle the speed during a charge.

Now that doesn't explain why you don't have throttling with your BMW.

My advice is to find a 48a Level 2 charger somewhere and see what happens. See what you can find on Plugshare. That will tell you if it's the truck or your charger.

I alternatively charge the F-150 and the I4 on the same charging station... located outside so heat no issue. I spoke with Autel and if such event would produce i would have a log in the application. As of this moment i have 100% confidence the F-150 is not accepting full capacity of the charging station apart from a few bouts during the charge. Which means it can.. but i doesn't want.

 

[Jesse-Infotainment]

I have the 50 AMP autel. Two of them set at 48 amp. Here lately in the hotter summer months I have noticed the EVSE lowering the output to 32amps after a while. I dont know the reason.. I assumed it was due to heat. It would be nice to know the reason for the slow down by whatever device makes that determination.

I never had the current drop in the cooler months. Here in Texas though it has been pretty hot. Not as hot as other summers.. but hot. Plus I park in the garage.

I have checked all connections at EVSE and panel. Retorqued. Still doing it. Pretty much convinced its heat for me.

 

[chl]

I bet most members driving 25's will report optimal charging in the 10 to 11 KW range, something unusual is going on with your situation.

Yes.
With my FCSP (Ford Charge Station Pro) is see around 44A most times on average so 10.6kW or so.

 

[chl]

I alternatively charge the F-150 and the I4 on the same charging station... located outside so heat no issue. I spoke with Autel and if such event would produce i would have a log in the application. As of this moment i have 100% confidence the F-150 is not accepting full capacity of the charging station apart from a few bouts during the charge. Which means it can.. but i doesn't want.

Sounds like a problem with the internal circuitry in the Lightning:
1) the AC-DC charger circuitry or another component between the port and the battery (loose connection?) or
2) a battery problem.

The Ford tech should be able to get to the root of it - they should test charging on their Ford charge stations to verify the derating and then diagnose what is wrong.

 

[Zprime29]

The charge rate is never managed by the charging station, always by the inboard charger.

Just wanted to clarify that the EVSE can and do manage the charge rate. My '22 is not capable of setting the desired charge rate so my only option is to set the rate on the EVSE. In my case, the FCSP.

As to your situation, you can already rule out the Autel since it charges the BMW just fine. You can confirm the problem is with the truck by attempting to charge with another EVSE that can can do 10Kw+. I agree with others, the dealer should have no problem figuring out what's up with it. At least it will charge for the time being. Hopefully it's a speedy fix/repair.

 

[Vulnox]

I would check the truck for a code like this:

May indicate the ambient temp is too high and the contact is getting higher than Ford would like. Even if another vehicle is charging at a higher rate, the manufacturer determines what temps they are comfortable with for these pins. That the truck is capable of hitting 11kW, clearly, but doesn't maintain it, indicates that it's slowing it down.

I don't see a dealer visit helping if this is what you are seeing because the dealer isn't going to change the Ford configured safety parameters. I would check the Autel connections for any corrosion or anything that may be leading to higher temps as well. I have seen this code thrown a few times between our vehicles when charging outside under the sun, but in the garage even at 90-ish degree ambient it's been fine.

 

[chl]

Just wanted to clarify that the EVSE can and do manage the charge rate. My '22 is not capable of setting the desired charge rate so my only option is to set the rate on the EVSE. In my case, the FCSP.

As to your situation, you can already rule out the Autel since it charges the BMW just fine. You can confirm the problem is with the truck by attempting to charge with another EVSE that can can do 10Kw+. I agree with others, the dealer should have no problem figuring out what's up with it. At least it will charge for the time being. Hopefully it's a speedy fix/repair.

The J1772 protocol is an interactive exchange using the signalling lines.

EVSE Signaling protocol: designed for the following charging sequence:
1) supply equipment (EVSE) signals presence of AC input power
2) vehicle detects plug via proximity circuit (thus the vehicle can prevent driving away while connected) and can detect when latch is pressed in preparation for plug removal.
3) Control Pilot (CP) functions begin
3a) supply equipment (EVSE) detects plug-in electric vehicle (PEV)
3b) supply equipment indicates to PEV readiness to supply current and modulates the signal indicating to the PEV how many amps it can supply *
3c) PEV ventilation requirements are determined
3d) supply equipment current capacity provided to PEV
4) PEV commands energy flow
5) PEV and supply equipment continuously monitor continuity of safety ground
6) charge continues as determined by PEV
7) charge may be interrupted by disconnecting the plug from the vehicle

-----
*The control pilot signal enables basic communication between the EVSE (charger) and EV (electrical vehicle): The charger sends the information about its maximum charging current in the form of a 1 kHz ±12 V pulse-width modulated (PWM) signal to the electric vehicle.

HOWEVER, that is where the control of the charging rate shifts to the vehicle circuitry, which ultimately determines the initial current level. Up to this point, the EVSE is merely a smart switch, telling the vehicle its MAX current capability.

The vehicle, by controlling its on-board charging circuitry, determines how much of that MAX EVSE capability it will utilize. If a problem is detected, like overheating somewhere in the circuits or battery, the vehicle can and will derate the current draw from the EVSE.

So even if you have a 48A capable EVSE, AND you have a 48A capable vehicle set to 48A MAX, that does not mean that amount of current will flow. The vehicle can and will lower the current, if it senses that is necessary, to a level that its programming or hardware deems as safe.

That said, if the EVSE also has sensors that can detect overheating, for example, it can ALSO derate the current rate or even shut it off completely. This has occurred with several FCSP according to posts.

Overheating and derating in the FCSP on occasion has been due to loose connections of the supply wires/terminals - they have to be torqued adequately to begin with and, over time and use, due to heating and cooling of the metal wire and terminals, can become loose. In such a case, tightening the terminals has solved the issue.

Other times, there has been some malfunction in the FCSP EVSE apparently.

In the OP's case, since the EVSE works fine with other vehicles, it is likely something in the truck charging circuitry, from and including the port to and including the battery, that is causing the truck to derate the charging current.

 

[Maquis]

I would check the truck for a code like this:

May indicate the ambient temp is too high and the contact is getting higher than Ford would like. Even if another vehicle is charging at a higher rate, the manufacturer determines what temps they are comfortable with for these pins. That the truck is capable of hitting 11kW, clearly, but doesn't maintain it, indicates that it's slowing it down.

I don't see a dealer visit helping if this is what you are seeing because the dealer isn't going to change the Ford configured safety parameters. I would check the Autel connections for any corrosion or anything that may be leading to higher temps as well. I have seen this code thrown a few times between our vehicles when charging outside under the sun, but in the garage even at 90-ish degree ambient it's been fine.

A faulty charge port can cause that code. Usually the thermistor is out of spec, it’s not really overheating, it just thinks it is!

 

[MountainAlive]

Interface is in French but you will recognize.

Amazing. I have not seen this before. Most of us have this in the app:

 

[Adventureboy]

If you have an opportunity to try a different EVSE, it would confirm if the problem is with the truck. The dealer will have some EVSEs set up, but they need to be 48 amps in your case. It sounds like a charge port sensor out of spec as @Maquis suggests.

 

[Newton]

If is important to you and you can still return the truck, then do so. I am pretty sure that the dealer is not going to be of much use here. Unless you are lucky and there is some code being thrown that the dealer can read and then invoice Ford for a repair you are going to have a hard time. It is difficult to find a tech that could do a proper electrical diagnosis (why are they working at an auto dealer with those skills?) and if they had one, they don’t want to spend hours of tech time chasing down an issue with a non-Ford product. The guy with the bad battery is always going to take precedence.

To solve the problem you are going to need an OBDII scanner, which is not expensive. It plugs into the OBDII port on the left side of the steering wheel (under the plastic). You can read codes, look at the inlet port (and others) temperature, voltage, and current. I use a vLinker MC+ and car scanner pro which gets you all of the data but has an interface from the 1980s. If you find high temperatures being reported then you might get some action. If you find large voltage drops, then get an electrician to check your setup.

Good luck! I have been waiting 6 months for a minor recall that I have been to the dealer twice for (the second time they assured me that they had the part, only to give me the deer in the headlight stare when I got there after a 2 hour drive.)

 

[Newton]

If you have an opportunity to try a different EVSE, it would confirm if the problem is with the truck. The dealer will have some EVSEs set up, but they need to be 48 amps in your case. It sounds like a charge port sensor out of spec as @Maquis suggests.

I would be more likely to think that was the case if it wasn’t for the fact that the truck charges at 8kW which is 32A of power and capable of generating a lot of heat. The bad temperature sensors that I am chasing on my heat pump hot water heater throw out ridiculous values, they are not just a few degrees off.

For the record, I usually charge at 20A/240V (around 3.8 kW) and it works fine. The only time I haven’t had power in the morning to do what I plan to is when I forgot to plug in after a trip. A quick visit to Tesla solved that.

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