Caution using heated seats, rear heated seat fire, [Not an EV Fire]

[queuewho]

Honestly I will say on level 3 my driver's seat becomes uncomfortable. On fire? I doubt it but I sure hope not.

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[TaxmanHog]

@Ford Motor Company needs to look into potential component defects, assembly errors, bad connections generate excess heat and burn.

 

[Danface]

WOW, sorry to hear that this happened and hope all involved are OK.

 

[Nate977p]

Man that's awful. So sorry that happened to you. Glad you and the dogs got away with minor injuries. Good luck at urgent care/vet.

Wow get some rest this is terrible. I wish you the best keep us posted.

Thank you! Arrived at the hotel many hours later than anticipate, but am up now as I've been restless from this whole thing.

They seem good, but our dogs are family (never wanted to be a crazy dog person, but here we are ). May be overkill to go, but I've always been told electric fumes/smoke is horrible for you, so better safe than sorry.

Luckily you and your dogs were not injured.

20-30 Years ago seat heater fires were quite common. Today, not as common but there have been the occasional failure across all brands.

The biggest takeaway is to only use the heaters when occupied by someone capable of feeling the heat and shutting it off if it's too hot.

In your case, the dogs weren't able to and in other cases I read, it was a car seat or something else that allowed the heat to get out of control.

Obviously, since it's 2024, these things shouldn't happen, and they arent common at all, hope Ford is able to take care of your situation.

Yeah, conceptually I understand there is a risk with a heating element in combustible material. Practically, I have never heard of this (driving ~20 years) and my first reaction would be there has to be an overtemp sensor. It could be a common risk from the past, but it didn't even cross my mind.

Waiting for @Ford Motor Company to ask you for your VIN and the name of your dealer (actually, to be fair, this might be one case where that's helpful!)

Yeah, the reason for the post was:

1. Warn others to be careful as this is something I have never heard of happening, especially in a modern vehicle.
2. Looking for help - we have to continue on this journey and I am not looking forward to the fight ahead with Ford. I've seen how issues like this go, especially at dealers, and it's all roadblocks until you find the right person at Corporate who can all of the sudden help.
3. Vent? I needed to put it on paper to get some relief. In retrospect it could've been so much worse and is addressable, but in the moment with not knowing what was happening, it was terrifying.

Wow, at this point it is an insurance thing to me unless your dealership wants to step up.

I would think it might be investigated as a warranty issue. No?

I wouldn't wash it through insurance just yet. Forget the dealer, this problem goes right to Ford.

Ya, I thought that it was odd he continued driving while the truck was smoking inside and he was aware of it. You don't have to be a ff or ems to realize that you should stop immediately.
Everyone should have a safety kit and fire extinguisher but most don't, nor would they know how to use one.

This is not going to be insurance, I will push tooth and nail with Ford. We have loved this truck, but last time we looked (month or so back), we lost 45% of the value on the truck in 1.5 years and ~12,000 miles. I've seen the threads around lost value on the forums here and not looking to get into that debate, but I'm not going to add an insurance hit to it too. No plans to sell it, but not going to let it depreciate more. Plus having to pay some deductible for what is a defect.

Wow. This is terrifying.

Glad you and the dogs are safe and I hope there's no lasting health issues from the smoke.

Can I ask what level you had the seat heaters on? 3 gets too hot for my comfort, almost always use 2. I'm going to speculate a bit here as I don't know how the seat heater is controlled. Is there a temperature sensor that controls the levels or if it is just programed to use duty cycle to control temp? It seems plausible that if it was a sensor and it went bad, it could have let the heater go out of control. In which case, I'd think it a warranty issue. If it's just controlled using duty cycle (proportion of time the heater is actively on) then I'm wondering if the heat was on high and over a long period of time. IF that's the cause, it feels like that should be a recall to fix the controlling software. Hard to say for sure, what a crummy situation. I hope the dealership/Ford are able to pinpoint the cause and it gets addressed quickly and appropriately.

Great question and part of why I posted. I think that back has 2 levels and I assume on level 2? I cannot recall. I do not understand how this happened in a modern vehicles. There are hundreds (obviously a guess) of sensors and what ~10 cameras? How is there not a sensor that kicks in to say "huh its over ~110 degrees, I should shut down". My understanding is that is how this worked. Not digging into it right now, but I remember there was a big recall or lawsuit around people getting burned by seat heaters, I think GM? Maybe my misunderstanding, but since then I thought heaters turn down after some time and have sensors for safety. This was after ~4 hours of driving.

 

[Maxx]

Awful. I wonder if there is weight and heat sensor (not sure if there are). But if there is, may be Dog was standing on the seat to provide enough weight to keep the heater on but not enough booty area to trigger the heat sensor to shot off or lower the heat. Until there is a resolution and answer to this, may be folks want to either turn off the rear seat heat when dog is back there or flip the seat up to be safe and let the dog sit/stand on the floor.

I doubt my Pro has backseat heater. I never use more than one bar of heat on my side. I don't want to look like this guy:

 

[Zprime29]

Glad to hear you and pups seem to be ok. Take your time to get what you need done and let us know how things progress with Ford when you have time. I'd be doing the same in your shoes, knocking on wood that Ford doesn't push back.

 

[Nate977p]

That's a horrible experience. The dogs must have been so happy to get home and be on someone's lap in the house.



A few things, from being a FF/EMT for 13 years, driving for nearly 30yrs, and have a dog.

• If your vehicle is filling with smoke, stop and get out. It doesn't matter how inconvenient the highway is. Fire inside a vehicle spreads in seconds.
  
  
• Have a fire extinguisher in the vehicle and readily accessible
  
  
• You don't need to "know someone at Ford". Take it to any dealer's service department.
  
  
• I know you're upset. But "OMG NOBODY EVER USE REAR SEAT HEATERS" is also just not right. This is a sample size of one, on a seat heater used in millions of vehicles. I will still use my seat heaters and I have no expectation that it will catch on fire.

Good point. @mods, can you help me tone down the title? I do want others to know in case there is something wrong and this isn't a fluke, but the title definitely has adrenal fueled "my car just had a fire behind it ". I am going to the dealer, but I've worked with many dealers and I need to get on the road this afternoon. Dealers love to add many roadblocks to actually getting in touch with Ford corporate, who ultimately will decide this path. I have every hope that Ford will do what's right here.

I know we don’t think clearly when things hit the fan but as stated earlier don’t look for an exit ramp. If there is a parking lane on the side of the road that’s your best bet. Turn on your emergency flashers & get out. If no parking lane pull over to the side & get out as mentioned.

That’s the public service announcement for the day. 28 years of fire/EMS here

I've had cars before that burned enough oil to make the heater output extremely stinky and maybe even vaguely smoky (1978 VW van RIP). So I can understand how one might treat a bad smell as something that requires pulling over very soon, but not in a dangerous spot along the highway. And it sounds like once there was actual visible smoke, what needed to happen happened. Seat foam is loaded with fire retardants and should smoulder, not burst into flame, and leather doesn't really burn and throw off smoke either unless you really get it going. Definitely would not blame the OP on this one.



I don't have a fire extinguisher in my truck. I have kept them in campers (appliances!) trailers, various work vehicles, but not my daily driver for many many years. Modern cars really don't catch fire very often and when they do, a handheld extinguisher isn't going to do much. That's been my thinking - which I have to admit I'm reconsidering now.

First thing - I carry a fire extinguisher in all cars I've owned and have for many years. In this case, I was thinking it was an EV fire and had no idea until it was extinguished it was the seat. My thought, Class C won't do anything against EV fire. Thus I wasn't going to risk harm to myself or the pups by trying to fight this. I also wasn't going to risk going close to the vehicle once I got away. Even if I wanted to, the pups were so alert that I wasn't going to try to tie them up with me 100 feet alone (and I didn't grab the leash as I evacuated).


On the safety, I think my late message was not very clear. I see how it came off that I drove a smoking vehicle until I found a "good spot". To clarify, that was NOT the case and I did what was best in the situation. I always like to be prepared, work in an industry where we have to deal with crises (not physical), and have practice dealing in vehicle emergencies (from track days and having had cars with failed brakes too many times ). I pulled over as soon as it was even remotely safe to do so. I know how these things go and its why the second I was stopped, I grabbed the dogs and ran 100 feet away. At the time, my assumption was this was an EV fire and those can turn from smoke to full on blaze in seconds.
A less adrenaline-fueled timeline (obviously this is not exact):

• 0 Minutes: Supercharged for ~30 minutes.
• 2 Minutes: Pull away and there is a faint smell. I think its either something I stepped in while walking the dogs at the charger, or something burning off from the battery heat during charging. Don't think anything of it yet. But don't ignore it. I always believe better safe than sorry when something doesn't feel right.
• 3 Minutes: Smell getting stronger, starting to think something is up. I call wife, tell her to stay on phone as something is strange and I may need to. No smoke yet, but trying to fine safe place to pull over ASAP. Fumes getting strong.
• 3.5 Minutes: Something is wrong and on fire. Very strong fumes. I go from trying to pull over safely to crisis mode and need to pull over ASAP.
• 3.5 - 5 Minutes: Balancing the risk of stopping on the middle of active highway at 1 AM, with barriers I could not scale and risk of getting emergency signals with getting off highway to stop there.

Thus the second something felt a tiny bit off, I call for backup just incase something is actually wrong. That escalates to emergency within seconds and look for to pull off where there is not an extreme risk of being hit by a car going 60 MPH. My only option to stop then was in the middle of a lane in a multi-lane highway that fluctuates between very high walls or being elevated, a 1/3 width breakdown lane, and has winding turns, while trying to control two dogs. In addition, I had dark clothes on. Wife tells me next exit is 1 mile up. I have no warnings on the truck and had full power, so I still have a drivetrain. My calculation is that I go the next mile, because if things get worse, I still have the option to stop in the middle of the highway and I need about 10 seconds to get dogs out of car, but there is a possibility I make it to a vastly safer place that is not literally middle of highway. I do that and as I reach offramp is where smoke starts. This is when I pull over, get out, and get 100 feet away.



Also, here is a shot of where I was and the "breakdown lane" and lack of ability to get off the active highway.

 

[pixelcloak]

Glad you and the dogs are safe! That's the most important thing. Trucks can be replaced. The truck is likely totaled if put through insurance, but in any event I'm hoping the process of getting it resolved goes smoothly for you.

 

[TaxmanHog]

Adjusted;

From: FIRE IN TRUCK! DO NOT USE REAR SEAT HEATERS (Interior fire, NOT EV Fire)was NOT an EV battery fire)

To: Caution using heated seats, rear heated seat fire, [Not an EV Fire]

 

[Nate977p]

It's not to save the vehicle. It's to save the humans who may still be trapped in the vehicle (be it yours or someone else's.


For sure. And consistent with what the picture shows and the OP described. If it was actually on fire, as in flames, the truck would be a smoking hole in the ground, probably before he stopped.

Yeah exactly why I always carry one. But my panic was this was a HVB fire, and I knew where extinguisher was, but would've been useless in that. I know how loaded seat materials are with retardants now. I'm quite flummoxed how the hole is so big and if it was this hot, how no sensor caught it.

 

[Nate977p]

Glad you and the dogs are safe! That's the most important thing. Trucks can be replaced. The truck is likely totaled if put through insurance, but in any event I'm hoping the process of getting it resolved goes smoothly for you.

Hope not! I cannot thank the Yonkers FD more. They prepped the hose, but investigated before spraying. They identified the fire and used the huge handheld extinguishers to put it out opposed to the hose.

 

[Nate977p]

Adjusted;

From: FIRE IN TRUCK! DO NOT USE REAR SEAT HEATERS (Interior fire, NOT EV Fire)was NOT an EV battery fire)

To: Caution using heated seats, rear heated seat fire, [Not an EV Fire]

Thank you! Pardon to make extra work for you!

 

[Grumpy2]

With my dog I would have not wanted to stop there! I think you did the right thing, and if the smoke has not done permanent damage to you & the pups, the truck is just a truck.
Thanks for the warning about the seats, they do get very hot!

 

[JRT]

https://www.elliott.org/company-contacts/ford/

Pinging at fordmotorcomany is useless and waste of time, the above has contact email to Jim Farley and other leadership, I'd send your pictures and story to all of them

 

[Heliian]

there has to be an overtemp sensor

For sure, that's why it's so rare these days.

However, the heating element itself may not be the problem but the wiring going to it may have caught fire.

A thorough investigation from ford and the manufacturer of the seat heater should point to the cause.

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